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Mark Dice - "Debunking Alex Jones Week"
10-13-2012, 08:46 AM,
#16
RE: Mark Dice - "Debunking Alex Jones Week"
At this point, imo, its just as pointless as complaining about someone like Bill O'Reilly, Bill Mahr, Limbaugh, or people in hollywood that pretend to give a shit. Don't like it, just turn it off and keep it moving.
"Listen to everyone, read everything, believe nothing unless you can prove it in your own research"
~William Cooper

DTTNWO!
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10-13-2012, 11:32 AM,
#17
RE: Mark Dice - "Debunking Alex Jones Week"
@ Flamesong.

I made my points earlier in relation to the thread, and SiLVa restated the primary one more succinctly, but there are a number of things you said which troubled me so I'd like to add a bit more.

For what it's worth I'm skint too, so I won't be watching David Icke until someone brings a rip here. But I will be watching. Why? Because Icke has an exceptional talent for putting things across in a way that the man in the street can understand and (entirely shamelessly) I'll be adopting certain phrases and linkages that he uses to improve my ability to educate and influence others.

So you believe that QEII is a lizard then?

Hardly. As with everything I don't have enough evidence for, I neither believe nor disbelieve, which kind of renders that part of his 'act' irrelevant to me, at least for now.

You pondered whom you ought to refer people to, but for me that's your first mistake. You are the only one you really can trust - and even then you have to be careful (and perpetually humble), because like me, you've undoubtedly swallowed bits of turd here and there. Accept that, but at the same time try to maintain an open mind, confident in the knowledge that you are always moving forward.

There's something I've said a thousand times, which is that the majority of people seem to be in search of a guru when what they really NEED is discernment. To put it much more crudely, people have a tendency to be lazy: to be followers rather than individuals in their search for truth. So, given that, how does one develop discernment in oneself?

Well, for myself, I pick through what I find in the alternative media like I'd pick through a box of uncut diamonds or a trailer load of rotting vegetables. I try to identify and ignore the items I consider worthless, but when I do find a little gem, I mark it for future reference and file it away. Then, when someone shows an interest in a particular topic I offer them the finest article, radio show or video that I have on the issue. Now if that turns out to be an AJ show or something like that, I'll cut out the dodgy bits, or if there isn't time, I'll offer the whole thing with a caveat (about the futility of looking for Superman).

The interesting thing with this approach is that not only do I end up with a bang up library of really focused and accessible material that I can use to influence others, but over time, as a result of the editing and selection process, I actually remember most of the key points myself, which makes my arguments stronger and even allows me to dispense with my library altogether in some areas.

Ah, but then you're simply offering yourself as a guru in place of AJ, right?

No, absolutely not. I'm developing the tools to help myself (and others) to stand on their own two feet. The ego is too complex a topic to get involved with here, but for sure, if you're a human being then at some point you have bring that into perspective and under control too.

By looking to 'refer' a person to someone else you are, in effect, taking a MSM junkie and converting them into an alternative media junkie. You are seeking to shift their dependency onto something 'better'. Please don't do this. Focus instead on empowering people: not all people, because sadly most of them truly ARE worthless (rotting vegetables) - and happy to be so I might add - so you need to concentrate your efforts on those who show a willingness to learn. It'll be much less frustrating for you and it represents the most efficient use of your limited energies.

As for your situation in particular, I sympathize. It's no fun being poor, especially in light of the inflationary horrors coming down the track, but for myself, I think it's important (again) to be aware of the dangers of developing what's been called a "culture of dependency". Twice now I've walked out on what would be considered "good" jobs, back in '97 and '06 respectively. The first offered excellent tenure, a reasonable salary and a good pension. The second brought me much more money but absolutely no security whatsoever. I left them both, simply because I wasn't being true to myself or to the people I interacted with and I have to say I'm happier now than I've ever been in my life - although I know for sure that if IanPotter circa 1990 were to look at contemporary IanPotter he'd be disgusted at his shabby home, straggly beard and total lack of ambition. It's all about perspective - and it's about taking back control - not of your country or your friends necessarily, but first and foremost of yourself.

I wrote this because I recognize and empathize with the strong element of despondency in your writing and yet many of the things I've come to value most, such as the sun, the sea, the laughter of children and springtime will always be free. Trite I know, but truthful nonetheless. It's also true that there are more and more people each day who are emerging from the stupor imposed on them by the scum that rule this planet - and that's as a direct result of the efforts of people like you and I; so hang in there dude. It ain't over yet. And even if it is, you can always go out and pick some free dandelions and make some kick-ass wine.

Eatdrink007
The three grand imperatives of imperial geostrategy are to prevent collusion and maintain security dependence among the vassals, to keep tributaries pliant and protected, and to keep the barbarians from coming together. Zbig the Ruthless.
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10-13-2012, 01:41 PM, (This post was last modified: 10-13-2012, 02:17 PM by h3rm35.)
#18
RE: Mark Dice - "Debunking Alex Jones Week"
ok, so I finally got around to reading this thread and I'm really glad I did.

You all have actually made a readable thread that takes both Icke and Jones into account! That's no small feat! I have to hand out thanks to flamesong and CharliePrime for doing what seems to not come naturally to most.

That having been said, I'll inject my belief/dogma/rhetoric onto the scene, just like an unwelcome shot of jiz in the eye...

I met Icke in Sedona, AZ (surprise!!!), and Jones in NY (actually a surprise,) both of whom seemed haggard and tired, even though they supposedly were surrounded by "supporters."

both were, when taken away from the crowds, decent people, at least to me, when they thought I wasn't going to print our conversations. They were humanists in the broadest sense.

As people, talking one to one (neither of which I was very familiar with when I met them. I was brought to their events because of peripheral reasons.) I was sure that they were, at heart, trying to look out for all of our best interests.

I feel the same about most preachers that I meet.

I haven't met many televangelists or radio-heavy bible-thumpers.

I would expect that they, to their friends and family, would look haggard and tired most of the time they're not preaching, since being a public face is hard work. Part of the problem that we face as a community is that we expect other people to be the faces and voices for us, when we know that sponsored faces and voices almost always lie so that they continue to be faces and voices. If somebody pays for your airtime, you have to say what they want you to, at least MOST of the time.

The reason why Icke and Jones get away with what they're doing is because if they were'nt shills and filling your head full of bullshit, they wouldn't be able to inject any truth.

I have less respect for Jones than for Icke, mostly because Jones tried to start off, sensationalistically or not, in a current that could make some change but ended up giving in. Icke's been using the looney train his entire career to relate truth obfuscated by blatant fiction, and as such is more of a coward. Both have both drastically helped and hurt the "fan" base they aimed to protect, but are no more at fault than the simpletons that have allowed them to be their brains and do their "thinking" for them.

I want to strongly point out here that I'm not blaming the victim. The people that ingest AJ & DI's stuff are people that should know better. They've been awakened to the point that they should comprehend a pay-wall as a red-flag.

Also, I should point out, that a period where a person is awakened to their reaity needs a moment or two (or a few years,) where they must feel comforted once they awaken by a preacher to the choir. "Gatekeeper" is an accurate term often used innacurrately on this site. It should be thought of as a means through which a new seeker learns to read between the lines. Instead its demonized in the ever-expanding "devide-and-conquer" strategy that's infested our way of life and thought.

That's what it comes down to, I think.

people trying to live in their own way, subverting their personal moral imperatives to the whim of a faceless, impersonal diety interpreted to them by someone who's just trying to pull off a comfortable existence for themselves.\


I hope I didn't strain anyone's 'scroll' finger with this post. If I did, I apologize.
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10-14-2012, 09:32 PM,
#19
RE: Mark Dice - "Debunking Alex Jones Week"
All people are susceptible to the terrible disease of shillery. Therefore the subtle martial art of shill-proofing is a valuable discipline for androids seeking enlightenment. No pain, no gain or no future increased possibility of pleasure when shills have stopped infesting your vision, turding up all punchbowls everywhere.

Basically the novice has to know that:

Shill-proofing is a life-long ongoing process each person has to do on their own and shill-proofing yourself from others & from yourself goes hand-in-hand. Anybody who was more-or-less honest today could end up a shill tomorrow and yes, even long-time shills may come to realize the error of their ways every once-in-a-while and correct themselves into upstanding denizens of reality.

Shill-proofing begins when you first start de-conditioning yourself from media & culturally induced programming which has run you off course into paths unprofitable to yourself by dangling fraudulent rewards, back into the correct path of reason, logic, facts & integrity which is its own reward and which only in a fraudulent system of fraudsters & their ass-kissers is not materially rewarding as well.

When people are conditioned a certain way from birth, there are certain triggers in each encountered situation, either 'real life' or cyber-life that make a certain pre-conditioned neuro-linguistic software program run & produce the Pavlovian reaction thereof. You literally cannot locate the meat while the different bells ring & your mouth waters. You always get an inferior substitute for the real meat at best if you're lucky enough to get any meat at all.

Each situation has conditioned you to act a certain way already that is most likely far from the natural or best way for you but serving other wider subliminally imposed interests of social engineering you're not even aware of. You meet your parents you run one program, you meet your friends you run another program, you meet the opposite sex you run another program, you encounter this or that historical fact that can be backed up with primary sources and you experience cognitive dissonance because you are triggered into running a program based on lies that conflicts with what you just discovered which agrees with reason and logic but not with the program you were conditioned to run, etc.

Pavlovian conditioning encompasses all areas of life a person has left unaware or free of conscious scrutiny. If you don't do your own conditioning, it's a 100% sure bet you will be conditioned by others who may not have your best interests at heart.

So, cognitive dissonance or the discovery of deep inconsistencies between the program you've been conditioned to run & the REAL PROGRAM, the one of an unchanging objective reality, facts & logic, deeply buried behind it, the program that you SHOULD be running for maximum functioning ability and satisfaction in all areas of life, that discrepancy is the event that creates the need for truth because it promises truth and not more confusion, light at the end of the tunnel.

To get at more truth you either consciously or more often unconsciously realize that you have to DE-CONDITION the triggers that run the old programs so they will now run improved programs progressively closer to the REAL PROGRAM which you may never reach or get to run bug-free your entire life. Nevertheless, the closer you get to the REAL program, after a certain point, you are rewarded with a certain odd and paradoxical mental clarity and peace-of-mind despite the paranoia you were expecting or may have experienced in earlier stages of the deconditioning. At a certain point, paranoia gives way to a clarity that trumps it, the knowledge that no matter what happens, that clarity itself is the very basis of any world worth living in.

Shill tests or litmus tests develop out of a consensus of half-truthers engaged in the process of de-conditioning themselves when they have all reached a certain point of knowledge about certain things.

Shill clearance certificates are given at each stage but depending on how advanced someone is on their deconditioning path they might refuse shill clearance to anyone who does not pass the important shill litmus tests that they feel they themselves have passed. Shill clearance certificates can, of course, be revoked immediately, if a shill-cleared zombie relapses into former idiocies & the shillotocracy.

Alex Jones has at least twenty-three(23) different radio and website sponsors that are Jewish owned and operated.

http://web.archive.org/web/20110726071113/http://alexjonesexposed.wordpress.com/alex-jones-and-jewish-money/

Who Controls Television ?

http://thezog.wordpress.com/who-controls-television/

Who Controls Big Media ?

http://thezog.wordpress.com/who-controls-big-media/

Who Controls the News ?

http://thezog.wordpress.com/who-controls-the-news-part-1/


Who Controls the Council on Foreign Relations ?

http://thezog.wordpress.com/who-controls-the-council-on-foreign-relations-part-1/


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Ricefoot's The Real Truth Behind The Illusion Of 9/11

http://vimeo.com/30094696

Interview with Simon Shack of September Clues - Brian S Staveley, Justin Cooke - 04 / 08 / 2012

http://www.therealnewsonline.com/uploads/6/5/2/9/6529494/4-8-12.mp3

Introductory Tour Guide to the September Clues research by Simon Shack - (updated on July 18 2011)

http://cluesforum.info/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=477

A Funny Thing Happened on the Way to the Moon (Full Movie) -

http://krishnatube.com/video/490/A-Funny-Thing-Happened-on-the-way-to-the-Moon

Deanna Spingola Interview with Bart Sibrel of "A Funny Thing Happened on the Way to the Moon"

http://k004.kiwi6.com/hotlink/403ze98ykc/spingola_20120316.mp3

Astronauts Gone Wild -

http://vimeo.com/24508433

Last Days of the Big Lie

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F7tHB8tD34s

September Clues

http://www.septemberclues.info

The Key - Collin Alexander

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rml2TL5N8ds&;

Michael Tsarion Archives

http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL1A96E0F13DE0202A&feature=plcp

Terence McKenna Archives

http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL9047054DC9FEBC85&feature=plcp

John Friend's Blog

http://johnfriendsblog.blogspot.com/

Mami - Freedom Monkey Radio Commercial Free Archives

http://grizzom.blogspot.com/
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10-15-2012, 02:43 PM,
#20
RE: Mark Dice - "Debunking Alex Jones Week"
I'm posting this exact same response to two separate threads I have contributed to recently because my feelings are identical in each case.

I am as aware of the difference between Jewish and Zionist as I am between a Semite and a Jew - so I don't need any lectures about that, thank you. But maybe some people do.

But recent posts on both threads have, whatever the poster's motive, made non sequitur references to Jews:

'Alex Jones has at least twenty-three(23) different radio and website sponsors that are Jewish owned and operated'

'Lots of Jews in and around this case it seems to me. Why am I not surprised?'


I am not a Jew and I do not have any reason to defend Jews. I am a nauseated opponent of Israel's treatment of the Palestinians, I have no doubt that there are many evil Jewish people in many walks of life and I am aware of a huge disproportion of Jewish MPs in the UK Parliament when compared to the population but I do not accept that there is anything intrinsically wrong with being Jewish.

As far as I'm concerned, when somebody resorts to making such statements, they plunge into a trap into which I will not follow. Prejudice has no merit in debate. In fact, it only exposes weaknesses.
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10-17-2012, 12:55 PM,
#21
RE: Mark Dice - "Debunking Alex Jones Week"
(10-15-2012, 02:43 PM)flamesong Wrote: I'm posting this exact same response to two separate threads I have contributed to recently because my feelings are identical in each case.

I am as aware of the difference between Jewish and Zionist as I am between a Semite and a Jew - so I don't need any lectures about that, thank you. But maybe some people do.

But recent posts on both threads have, whatever the poster's motive, made non sequitur references to Jews:

'Alex Jones has at least twenty-three(23) different radio and website sponsors that are Jewish owned and operated'

'Lots of Jews in and around this case it seems to me. Why am I not surprised?'


I am not a Jew and I do not have any reason to defend Jews. I am a nauseated opponent of Israel's treatment of the Palestinians, I have no doubt that there are many evil Jewish people in many walks of life and I am aware of a huge disproportion of Jewish MPs in the UK Parliament when compared to the population but I do not accept that there is anything intrinsically wrong with being Jewish.

As far as I'm concerned, when somebody resorts to making such statements, they plunge into a trap into which I will not follow. Prejudice has no merit in debate. In fact, it only exposes weaknesses.


Prejudice has merit when it's based on facts & not fantasy. It depends on what are you Pre-Judging and why ?

For example, if you're a Korean store owner & 10 straight shoplifters you bust in your store turn out to be blacks for every white one you bust, & then you also get held up by a robber who turns out to be black, you pre-Judge, if you are intelligent, that blacks, being only 12% of the population of the USA and whites 73%, these incidents corroborate the general statistics that show blacks commit far more crimes relative to their population than whites.

Therefore, you conclude, that the reason why more than 50% of the prison population of the USA is black is more likely to be because they actually committed lots of crimes than the 'system' being against them.

Therefore you develop a fully justified pre-judice & watch your back around blacks a lot more than you would around whites. You don't move to black neighborhoods because you're rational and you don't enjoy violence and don't want to increase your chances of getting your ass kicked in or robbed whereas you don't mind moving into a majority white neighborhood, even a lower-middle-class one, much at all because you don't mind decreasing your chances of encountering violence or getting your ass kicked in or robbed.

Same thing with Jews who've been kicked the fuck out of 109 countries & territories in the past 1000 years & who seem to be at the central of every single gigantic criminal racket on the planet, from central banking usury to pornography to Monsantao GMO seeds to the African Slave trade to White slavery to illegal organ sales, etc. the list is a VERY LONG ONE. Most of these criminal activities are promoted against the gentile 'goys' or non-Jew cattle by their own teachings.

Therefore, fully justified pre-judice & watching your back against Jews & not so-called Zio-nists only. Zionists have only been around since the late 19th century.

The general rule does not invalidate the individual exception & neither does the individual exception invalidate the general rule.

Facts are all that matter. When enough facts corroborate the general stereotype then it stays, when they don't then it goes away.

The word pre-judice itself being equated to 'bigot' or an unreasonable or irrational intolerance through deliberate media conditioning and literal corruption of the English language is a meaningless brainwashing ploy to keep you from using your brains and thinking in EXACTLY the ways that would protect yourself & your loved ones the most.
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