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The American Revolution is here and you still occupy your couch at home .-)
10-03-2011, 03:13 PM,
#1
Rainbow  The American Revolution is here and you still occupy your couch at home .-)
The American Revolution is here and you still occupy your couch at home .-)
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10-03-2011, 04:55 PM,
#2
RE: The American Revolution is here and you still occupy your couch at home .-)
Oh, thank goodness. I was thinking that, with all these people stirring up trouble and talkin' shit against the establishment, which clearly knows more about all this global crap than we do, I'd have to take up arms or something and get scratched or bruised in the process.

I tell you, if it were possible to fight wars with TV remotes, I'd be totally there.

Bam bam! Zing! Bzzzzzt!
Truth appears in many forms. Find those that resonate with you.

- "If we do not believe in freedom of speech for those we despise, we do not believe in it at all." - Noam Chomsky
- "Humans are not a rational animal, but a rationalizing one." - Leon Festinger

http://avaaz.org - The World In Action
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10-06-2011, 03:52 AM, (This post was last modified: 10-06-2011, 03:53 AM by BaBaYaGa.)
#3
RE: The American Revolution is here and you still occupy your couch at home .-)
Well I for one am not going to revolt until my TV tells me to.

Wait, what's that--Oh CNN and MSNBC are strongly encouraging young people to "get involved". I guess I better join in with a crowd of people who are, on average, maybe 5% awake to what the real problems are and where they stem from. No way our movement will get co-opted with THAT kind of intellectual acumen! Okay, here I go, off to REVOLT, man! It's the "American Autumn", as labeled by the corporate media! It's the trendy thing to do, man! I'm gonna wear my Che Guevara shirt and save my George Washington costume for next summer when Fox tells me to join in with the Tea Party again! Doing what the TV tells me to do is awesome! I'm so, like, INFORMED from watching cable news and "keeping up with all the issues"!!
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10-06-2011, 05:03 AM,
#4
RE: The American Revolution is here and you still occupy your couch at home .-)
Now there's an interesting thought, BaBaYaGa.

So the youth is being encouraged to revolt against certain aspects of the system while the powers that be direct them away from other areas that said powers can use to continue their onslaught of oppression. As those immortal words go, "what a twist!"

(On another note, typing your alias ensures I make sufficient use of my SHIFT key. Let's hope I don't run out of SHIFT fluid or I'll have to stick to using CAPSLOck.. oh shit, there we go...)
Truth appears in many forms. Find those that resonate with you.

- "If we do not believe in freedom of speech for those we despise, we do not believe in it at all." - Noam Chomsky
- "Humans are not a rational animal, but a rationalizing one." - Leon Festinger

http://avaaz.org - The World In Action
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10-06-2011, 08:19 PM,
#5
RE: The American Revolution is here and you still occupy your couch at home .-)
I hope you all understand revolution without a guillotine is no revolution at all. If you vote for someone else than 4 years ago, that's not a revolution. If you demand the end of capitalism, that's just their clever manipulation. Real capitalism ended in 1913 anyway. If you plan to run to the hills with some chickens and stored food, that's also not a revolution.

When millions of people start feeling that primal bestial rage and nobody can stop them -- that's a revolution!

Revolution is coming, and it will be violent and bloody as hell. Nothing can prevent it, it is too late to "work the system", everything went too far, people just don't feel it yet in entirety. Traders and independent researchers can confirm this, they can see the trends before they manifest. This is really a great time, so much is happening at once! Smile
"Success is the sole earthly judge of right and wrong." -- Herr Wolf
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10-06-2011, 10:46 PM,
#6
RE: The American Revolution is here and you still occupy your couch at home .-)
(10-06-2011, 08:19 PM)Armilus Wrote: I hope you all understand revolution without a guillotine is no revolution at all.

You mean you hope we all share your opinion that revolution must include killing. I don't, and I have a healthy mistrust for people that do, for obvious reasons.
[Image: randquote.png]
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10-06-2011, 10:59 PM,
#7
RE: The American Revolution is here and you still occupy your couch at home .-)
Check human history, pretty much any revolution required blood and sacrifices. You can't "vote out" bad guys, they aren't that stupid.

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots & tyrants."
-- Thomas Jefferson
"Success is the sole earthly judge of right and wrong." -- Herr Wolf
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10-06-2011, 11:11 PM,
#8
RE: The American Revolution is here and you still occupy your couch at home .-)
(10-06-2011, 08:19 PM)Armilus Wrote: I hope you all understand revolution without a guillotine is no revolution at all.

This is not true.

2011? Arab spring? non-violent revolutions? haven't you heard?

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10-06-2011, 11:24 PM,
#9
RE: The American Revolution is here and you still occupy your couch at home .-)

I just watched a CNN piece that briefly covered occupy Wall Street. What was strange about it was that it was truthful with no spin. Some guy in the background said: She's lying to you America!.

Kind of weird.

http://www.cnn.com/2011/10/06/opinion/reiss-street-protests/ This is pretty accurate too (lol @ the last paragraph)

http://www.cnn.com/2011/10/05/politics/occupy-wall-street/

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10-06-2011, 11:49 PM,
#10
RE: The American Revolution is here and you still occupy your couch at home .-)
Armilus does make a fair point regarding history's "revolutions"...

...but then, like I have said many times before, we don't want a FULL REVOLUTION, that means to end up in the same place as before, with a ruling elite. Armilus may want such a revolution, which of course does mean war and death, a change of the "face" of the ruling class (we know the higher echelons never change). Maybe like the French Revolution, right, because that made things better, right? What? It didn't, ah...it must have been a full revolution (360 degrees) LOL

The only reason I see through the myth of revolution bringing change for the common man (like myself) is that I, many years ago, realised the absurdity of the term "reformation". Why would you want to "reform" or "revolve" in the first place?

I think the term that Ron Paul's campaign use, though cheesy, make FAR more sense... reLOVEution. And that doesn't mean it's an endorsement of Ron Paul, I'm in the UK anyway...and don't vote any more.
"He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked." -- 1 John 2:6
"Whatever affects one directly, affects all indirectly... This is the interrelated structure of reality." -- Martin Luther King Jr.
"He that answereth a matter before he heareth it, it is folly and shame unto him." -- Proverbs 18:13
"Everyone thinks of changing the world, but no one thinks of changing himself." -- Leo Tolstoy
"To love is to be vulnerable" -- C.S Lewis

The Kingdom of God is within you! -- Luke 17:20-21

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10-07-2011, 04:02 AM,
#11
RE: The American Revolution is here and you still occupy your couch at home .-)
(10-06-2011, 10:59 PM)Armilus Wrote: You can't "vote out" bad guys, they aren't that stupid.

You're not so stupid as to not have heard of the word "jail", are you? Do you really expect us to believe there is no alternative to killing people? Never mind, obviously you do...

[Image: randquote.png]
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10-07-2011, 04:42 AM,
#12
RE: The American Revolution is here and you still occupy your couch at home .-)
When we choose to take actions that others have taken in the past, it's not a revolution. It's a rerun. It's akin to "doing what everyone else does."

Armilus' point about revolutions encompasses only the notion that revolutionaries are dictators in sheep's clothing - to expect death in all revolutions stinks of lack of imagination and lack of humanity on the part of those suggesting or supporting political murder, especially today when our greater numbers can easily be used to prevent unnecessary deaths, and people (particularly soldiers) are more open to humanitarianism than in the past.

The only reasons one has to kill people in a political arena is to oppress, enslave or censor. In this day and age, we have the resources to make changes without resorting to such barbaric acts.
Truth appears in many forms. Find those that resonate with you.

- "If we do not believe in freedom of speech for those we despise, we do not believe in it at all." - Noam Chomsky
- "Humans are not a rational animal, but a rationalizing one." - Leon Festinger

http://avaaz.org - The World In Action
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10-07-2011, 09:32 AM, (This post was last modified: 10-07-2011, 09:36 AM by Armilus.)
#13
RE: The American Revolution is here and you still occupy your couch at home .-)
(10-06-2011, 11:11 PM)attariq Wrote:
(10-06-2011, 08:19 PM)Armilus Wrote: I hope you all understand revolution without a guillotine is no revolution at all.

This is not true.

2011? Arab spring? non-violent revolutions? haven't you heard?

You mean Tunisia and Egypt? Those two were relatively peaceful, with some random violence. Libya and Syria today are hell, a lot of violence, and foreign forces involved.

(10-06-2011, 11:49 PM)Dunamis Wrote: Armilus does make a fair point regarding history's "revolutions"...

...but then, like I have said many times before, we don't want a FULL REVOLUTION, that means to end up in the same place as before, with a ruling elite. Armilus may want such a revolution, which of course does mean war and death, a change of the "face" of the ruling class (we know the higher echelons never change). Maybe like the French Revolution, right, because that made things better, right? What? It didn't, ah...it must have been a full revolution (360 degrees) LOL

The only reason I see through the myth of revolution bringing change for the common man (like myself) is that I, many years ago, realised the absurdity of the term "reformation". Why would you want to "reform" or "revolve" in the first place?

I think the term that Ron Paul's campaign use, though cheesy, make FAR more sense... reLOVEution. And that doesn't mean it's an endorsement of Ron Paul, I'm in the UK anyway...and don't vote any more.

Yes, like the French Revolution, but with a bit different politics. I most dislike the fact they killed a lot of innocent and capable nobles, that was unnecessary. French Revolution wouldn't be complete without Napoleon's reforms later, many of which were continuation of revolutionary reforms started earlier. It accomplished many things, for instance Constitution was accepted, then personal liberties recognized, (almost) free speech, and other things people take for granted today. This was not enough for Napoleon, he had a vision of a united Europe, 200 years ago(!): "I wished to found a European system, a European Code of Laws, a European judiciary: there would be but one people in Europe," and "Europe thus divided into nationalities freely formed and free internally, peace between States would have become easier: the United States of Europe would become a possibility."

(10-07-2011, 04:02 AM)yeti Wrote:
(10-06-2011, 10:59 PM)Armilus Wrote: You can't "vote out" bad guys, they aren't that stupid.

You're not so stupid as to not have heard of the word "jail", are you? Do you really expect us to believe there is no alternative to killing people? Never mind, obviously you do...

I meant bigger revolutions, with a lot of people supporting them, not individuals or small groups of people doing foolish things. Well, of course there are alternatives, but statistically speaking chances of having non-violent revolution are very slim. Some may even argue that a revolution as "A forcible overthrow of a government or social order for a new system." without the use of force is not even a proper revolution. Even if it is, it wouldn't feel right.

(10-07-2011, 04:42 AM)thokling Wrote: When we choose to take actions that others have taken in the past, it's not a revolution. It's a rerun. It's akin to "doing what everyone else does."

Armilus' point about revolutions encompasses only the notion that revolutionaries are dictators in sheep's clothing - to expect death in all revolutions stinks of lack of imagination and lack of humanity on the part of those suggesting or supporting political murder, especially today when our greater numbers can easily be used to prevent unnecessary deaths, and people (particularly soldiers) are more open to humanitarianism than in the past.

The only reasons one has to kill people in a political arena is to oppress, enslave or censor. In this day and age, we have the resources to make changes without resorting to such barbaric acts.

It still is a revolution, because you are overthrowing existing power structures. Just like war, it is damn real every time it starts, even if they use same weapons and tactics as before.

Yes, i am talking about revolutions led by a central command, usually a dictator or the emperor. It is most effective that way. Yes, there are alternatives to violence, but there is also a danger people who are overthrown will strike back, so you need to make sure they are incapacitated. "Men ought either to be indulged or utterly destroyed, for if you merely offend them they take vengeance, but if you injure them greatly they are unable to retaliate, so that the injury done to a man ought to be such that vengeance cannot be feared.", Machiavelli wrote, and he is right. It applies to all societies, past and present. Being barbaric, well that comes naturally to barbarians. Smile

***

That's my view on revolution, what you have today is some weird mix of grassroots movements with political and media manipulation. Hard to say what all this means and where it will end. Economy failing will only contribute to the overall frustration and then situation may become volatile. Left is very active now, i think we can expect far-right to mobilize soon. They are discussing it on forums. Groups of that type get more support when economy takes a downturn, because people want order and stability.
"Success is the sole earthly judge of right and wrong." -- Herr Wolf
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10-07-2011, 11:25 AM,
#14
RE: The American Revolution is here and you still occupy your couch at home .-)
Armilus: The mentality and fear of the old order is the cause for the backwater aspects of our planet's cultures which prevent us, as a species and as peoples, from advancing beyond the need for blood, revenge and fear. To kill a person, no matter who, is to restrict humanity from becoming more than what it can be. All people, whether one perceives them as good or evil, have a right to live and a right to act.

You are responding to a gang mentality with a gang mentality. It's not dictators we should fear, but ourselves. A dictator is nothing without animals to chain together as a weapon against others.

You are one of the problems which must be changed. Your attitude towards your fellow humans is distasteful and does nothing to honour or support what our species is now capable of.

It's amusing you used the name Machiavelli in defense of your position. Machiavelli lived during a time when humanity's potential remained unrefined. It's been several hundred years since his time, and we have the opportunity today, with our global interconnectivity, to make a positive difference for once. We've grown more knowledgeable and wise since Machiavelli's time.

I find it disappointing that you are advocating murder as a response against those who advocate fear. You have come across in your many posts as being fearful of your environment and of the potential of humanity. You would make a fine dictator, except you lack the charisma, the wisdom and the intelligence to guide people toward the deaths of millions. I would say that's a point in your favour.

You have proven yourself through words to be nothing more than an animal who has somehow managed to pick up the ability to string words together to perpetuate your fear and distrust, two attributes that will do nothing to serve humanity beyond providing an example of what is truly holding us back from being pretty damned magnificent.
Truth appears in many forms. Find those that resonate with you.

- "If we do not believe in freedom of speech for those we despise, we do not believe in it at all." - Noam Chomsky
- "Humans are not a rational animal, but a rationalizing one." - Leon Festinger

http://avaaz.org - The World In Action
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10-07-2011, 04:45 PM, (This post was last modified: 10-07-2011, 04:47 PM by Armilus.)
#15
RE: The American Revolution is here and you still occupy your couch at home .-)
You deserve no reply -- but what the hell... I'm bored.

Dude, don't write bad stuff like that, it may lower your vibratory state, and then you will be forced to share this planet with primitives for eternity!! Big Grin

What i described is reality, check your history books or evening news. And believe it or not -- i am not telling them to fight. It is crooked thieves and sly politicians who are responsible for most of the recent wars. Of course people will believe their lying propaganda, and dislike those who are telling the truth. I know how short-sighted people are, so i don't really care how you perceive it. Not trying to win any popularity contest either.

I see you base your argument on a faulty assumption people who are forced to defend themselves, are nothing else than primitive animals. That's really stupid thing to say. Patriots bled for our liberty, they fought not out of fear, but out of survival. They had a vision of liberty and a bright future for everyone! All the moral idiots who condemn them for using violence deserve nothing else than tyranny! So then, in time, some of you will be forced to fight for your own survival in most primitive and brutal ways.
"Success is the sole earthly judge of right and wrong." -- Herr Wolf
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