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You Are A Cosmic Being!
10-21-2006, 11:40 AM,
#46
You Are A Cosmic Being!
it would "prove " you are capable of voicing your opinion on a question posed,
no more no less, i'm not asking for "proof" , am i?
merely inquiring what you perspective on it might be.
if you think it's irrelevant or non of my concern, nevermind then.

peace'
standvast.
If Thine I that I spy with my own little I Doeth Offend thee ; Pluck It out.

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10-21-2006, 02:05 PM,
#47
You Are A Cosmic Being!
I hate to point out the obvious, but genetically speaking... if we were all descended from only two people, if we were even able to survive, the inbreeding would cause us all to be something along the lines of six-fingered albino banjo players.

DER-DER-NER-NER--NER-NER--NER-NER-NERRRR
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10-21-2006, 03:40 PM,
#48
You Are A Cosmic Being!
Sorry Standvast I didnt ment it in a pernicios way but i still dont know why does the years between adam and eve actualy living and the writeings of their story matter...

Tsoldrin you dont belive in God (not the bible "One" at least) so why keep asking questions about Him or His work? It clear that (if you belive in the bible God) that He created Adam and Eve PERFECT! now if you would study the genetic problem of why through interbreeding children have an high risk of being borned deformed you would understand that if our genome would be "perfect" (like it was before the fall, the sin, the curse etc) interbreeding would (theoretical - or practical if you would belive in God) deformities would not occur! If my sister and i would have a child he would probably have clear deformaties since our genes inherited similar small "mistakes" from our parents. If i have a child with a distant (geneticly) female the small "mistakes" in my genes (diferent from hers and similar to my sisters) would be overwrited by her good genes and her small "mistakes" in her genes would be overwriten by my good ones in our child (since good genes tend to overwrite bad genes - bad genes that appeard after the fall)

I think its clear to all that we are not evolving! We are devolving! even in a darwinistic evolution way we would still be regresing since we are adapting to our enviroment an artificial enviroment where without our gadgets we couldend survive! So we are not evolving either way (creationist or darwinistic) you look at the problem!

Now you would think that the idea of related ancestors would seem ridiculous ...well science dosent think so! They say Adam and Eve did exist! but they call them scientifical Adam (some black african dude that lived 60000 years ago) and mitrocondrial Eve (didnt locate her in time very well but all females are related through this eve)

-Hope you understand some of this since i dont have time to elaborate more ...nor to check for mistakes in spelling!
&Many people would sooner die than think; in fact they do so!& - Bertrand Russell
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10-21-2006, 04:09 PM, (This post was last modified: 10-21-2006, 04:09 PM by standvast.)
#49
You Are A Cosmic Being!
Quote:Sorry Standvast I didnt ment it in a pernicios way but i still dont know why does the years between adam and eve actualy living and the writeings of their story matter...

Maybe the period itself doesn't matter all that much, as it isn't checkable,
but ones personal view or formulation of creation theory and first time / first man /woman
is very interresting to me, i'd figured you may have a take on it i can constructivly reflect on.

well if there was only oral transmission of the story [spoken accounts] of the
life of Adam and Eve, i reckon it was the people who reported on the story earliest [in writing] that may have
a more complete story than those that wrote their report 5000 years later, just to pick a timespan.
Creation [of man] myth / history [the truth is somewhere i the middle me thinks] differs through
various ancient cultures as you assumably well know, besides differences there are a lot of paralels
one can hardly overlook.,
So what theory or what account do we use to disseminate the "first man/woman story, and what account
do we choose when two stories tell us very different things.. or do we take the best of both?
-the observation/debate of the kind of reasoning behind methods appeals to me. that's why i ask.:)


peace'
standvast.
If Thine I that I spy with my own little I Doeth Offend thee ; Pluck It out.

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10-22-2006, 11:30 AM,
#50
You Are A Cosmic Being!
Quote:The story has a clear parallel with Eve's creation from Adam's rib, but given that the pun with rib is present only in Sumerian, linguistic criticism places the Sumerian account as the more ancient.

As mentioned earlier, this mean's ALMOST nothing. It just shows that someone besides God knew about the creation plan, and was smart enough to make a counterfeit so that the true and actual event can't be discerned anymore.

satan anyone ... ?

Quote:That "story" predates the Old Testament by thousands of years and even predates the Hebrew language itself.

says who ? A bunch of biased "scientists" who believe in evolution and use carbon dating as an "accurate" method of dating objects? rofl


Quote:Do you think Adam and Eve where given the gift of speech and writing instantaniously?
Standvast remember that God made them Himself. They were not born and slowly learned how to talk and walk. They knew A LOT. They probably knew what a thermo nuclear missile is :D just kiddin
Matthew 7:14
Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

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10-22-2006, 02:53 PM,
#51
You Are A Cosmic Being!
@Quetzalcoatl:

If anyone were PERFECT they would not reproduce sexually, as that is about mixing genes. Mixing genes would be a BAD thing for a 'perfect' creature, thus it would never have evolved, or if it did, the imperfect ones in which sexual reproduction evolved in would be out competed by perfect ones and the trait would have died out.

As far as Mitochondrial Eve and Y-chromosomal Adam, these people certainly never met, much less bred together. They are simply the most recent ancestors that can be traced back which are genetically related to everyone alive today. Actually in the case of Adam, it only relates to MALES, however Eve is related to all human beings, both male and female. Eve traces back 150,000 years and Adam only 60,000 to 90,000, so obviously they didn't breed together.


@DHammer:

If you learned even the most rudimentary beginings of science I think you might find your own 'arguments' ridiculous. I'd actually suggest that you check it out, if only to better bolster your own arguments and give some validity to your point of view, though I am pretty sure that everyone thus far who has 'checked things out' has abandoned their antiquated thinking in favor of reality.

One thing you might want to look into would be radio carbon dating, because modern radio carbon dating is fully accepted as incredibly accurate. The absolute only reason that lay people question this accuracy is due to a conspiracy (yes, a real one!) by certain religious factions to discredit it - because it discredits them. If you take a moment to think on this, it should be abundantly obvious.

On the one hand you have a small group of religous leaders who push their beliefs on the unsuspecting masses and receive incredible profit and power by doing so. On the other hand you have thousands of scientists, amateur hobbyists and students who have nothing to gain by discrediting anything and by nature of their field obviously have no interest in either power or richest but only in discovery and knowledge. Who is the more likely group of conspirators?

---

As far as Adam and Eve themselves go... I believe they existed, I just don't buy the non-sensical 'theories' behind them. I think it's very likely that Adam and Eve were either members of a rather long-lived advanced ancient society (Atlanteans if you will, though I don't care for the term, but the concept holds) who 'went native', mixing with the primitives in the world outside of that society and raising them up to civilized people, OR perhaps they themselves were also members of the primitives and that which people call 'God' was the civilizer from the ancient society and they were simply the first to be 'raised up' or civilized. Certainly to people living practically as animals, civilized folks with the wonders of whatever technology they possesed would seem like Gods.

Thus I see Adam and Eve not as the progenitors of the human race, but the founders of civilization.

As far as 'why' the ancients would civilize the primitives, if it wasn't simply for altruistic reasons , they may have seen their own coming demise, possibly at the hands of a natural disaster (flood) and set out to save something of themselves in the likelihood that all might be lost. Leaving behind something of yourself or your society in this fashion would be a form of imortality.
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10-22-2006, 04:11 PM,
#52
You Are A Cosmic Being!
Quote:One thing you might want to look into would be radio carbon dating, because modern radio carbon dating is fully accepted as incredibly accurate.

the official version of 9/11 is also "fully accepted as incredibly accurate" by the government. does that mean anything ? no.
Quote:On the one hand you have a small group of religous leaders who push their beliefs on the unsuspecting masses and receive incredible profit and power by doing so.
does that mean that the "weapons"(Bible's) they use are EVIL ? no.
Quote:On the other hand you have thousands of scientists, amateur hobbyists and students who have nothing to gain by discrediting anything and by nature of their field obviously have no interest in either power or richest but only in discovery and knowledge.

ohh is that so ? their beliefs (evolution for ex) will most likely influence their work.
Quote:I believe they existed, I just don't buy the non-sensical 'theories' behind them.
it doesn't really matter what you believe or think, does it ? it's about what is true and what is a lie.
I see you have two theories about Adam and Eve. That means one of them is wrong. It means you yourself haven't found the truth about this couple. It means that you should still search and accept ANY given theory as POSSIBLE or PROBABLE.
your sig fits you well " The Theorist formerly known as 'no'."
Matthew 7:14
Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

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10-22-2006, 04:46 PM,
#53
You Are A Cosmic Being!
Tsoldrin when i say perfect i meant geneticly perfect - that means genes will mix well together without creating "mistakes" - like its curently happening because of the sin (perfect is only God - again i didnt meant the philosophical perfectcy)

Second where did you get your info on Mitochondrial Eve and Y-chromosomal Adam ...please dont say wikipedia

And about 14C dating anything over 50.000 years old, should have no detectable 14C left! (cuz all the carbon is transformed in nitrogen14)- so itz amazing how they can say that this lived 60000 years ago or milions or whatever! - but its not that simple - for ex. diferent levels of gases in the atmosphere (and many other events - but you can google stuff and find out for yourself) can make the transformation from 14C to 14N much faster - and we all know that was the case with the time the dinosaurs lived - like much more oxigen to support the megafauna(this is mainstream) So how do they get to this milions uppon milions of years? by the layers of rock shit is found in! But that also is very very flowed! (i will not go in to this)

- I belive that the simple fact that they admited that we are all conected (from mitochondrial Eve and her m8 or whatever you want to call them) proves that the ancients that where not just writing "Harry Potter" kind of stories but the truth - and if they where writing the truth about our beginings they where also about God! - Who will you belive? todays science - that perverts everything to theyr own views - and whos ideas change each day - new theories replace old ones each day in almoust every field of research (and this prooves just how shaky our "scientifical" view of this world is - changeing every day ) or the bible - a bunch of "crazy" stories written by people much closer to the events they describe (then we) and who, each day, are proven more and more to be right (i dont even want to go in the fulfiled prophecies part cuz as you probably know 85% of the bible prophecies allready happend exactly as described - and the last 15% are unfolding as we speack!)

So Tsoldrin - search the answers to your questions well - see how science was changed through our history and the bible remaind the same - always acurate!
&Many people would sooner die than think; in fact they do so!& - Bertrand Russell
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10-26-2006, 09:21 PM,
#54
You Are A Cosmic Being!
Quote:
Quote:29/09/2006.

"When you are in your room, you are physically isolated within its
four walls, set apart from the world. But by means of thought you
can make a habit of going beyond the limits of your room and
expanding into an ever greater space: into your house, into the
town your house belongs to... Then, realize that your town
belongs to a region, the region to a country, the country to a
continent, and the continent to the earth. As for the earth, it
is one of the planets that belongs to the solar system. The
solar system in turn belongs to a galaxy, and this galaxy is a
small part of the cosmos. How amazing, then, that you are alone
in your room and at the same time out in the cosmos!
ect..."
Omraam Mikhaël Aïvanhov
sounds like - remote viewing
Sounds like nothing more than extrapolative imagination to me, which may be nothing more than a property of an intelligent enough mind. I fail to see this New Age-ish conclusion that humans are cosmic beings one with the universe based on human's power to imagine the universe. Show me the logical imperative. Don't get me wrong I want to be recognized more than a temporary vehicle for genes made of bones, flesh and other organic matter, but cannot do so based on this poetic flower-power prose. But then again reading poetic material was never my forte so I'm open for your interpretations and change direction accordingly.
General Brainquirks:http://1phil4everyill.wordpress.com

Mind control imbued by movies:http://predictiveprogramminginmovies.blogspot.com

Movers and Shakers of the SMOM:http://moversandshakersofthesmom.blogspot...identity.html
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