Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
The New Age - A Pathway To Paradise
10-29-2006, 06:07 PM,
#76
The New Age - A Pathway To Paradise
ov3rkomer, how do you know that this "spirit of Jesus Christ" is not infact a nefarious entity, appearing as "an angel of light" or something?
How do you know its actually Christ, and not some entity merely mainfesting in a form that you would percieve to be Jesus?

Have you ever seen Pentacostals doing their thing? Are you going to tell me that is the result of Jesus and not their own mind working themselves into a religious frenzy? Their "being filled with the holy spirit" is more akin to demonic possession and influece, when compared with buddhist styles of meditation, and even other "pagan" spiritual practices that involve communing with non-physical entities.
Wyrd bi∂ ful aræd : Vituð ér enn eða hvat?
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
[Image: madwolfoy0.jpg][Image: sharksmall1kd6.jpg][Image: bearkodiakchugachfe7.jpg]
Reply
10-30-2006, 10:54 AM, (This post was last modified: 10-30-2006, 10:57 AM by ov3rkomer.)
#77
The New Age - A Pathway To Paradise
Quote:ov3rkomer, how do you know that this "spirit of Jesus Christ" is not infact a nefarious entity, appearing as "an angel of light" or something?
How do you know its actually Christ, and not some entity merely mainfesting in a form that you would percieve to be Jesus?
Good questions which require spiritual discernment. As you know, I believe the Bible is the absolutely trustworthy Word of God. This gives me guidance on which spirit to trust and which spirit to deny. Jesus said quite a lot about this:
<blockquote>And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever; Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you. (Joh 14:16-17)

But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me: And ye also shall bear witness, because ye have been with me from the beginning. (Joh 15:26-27)

And I say unto you, Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you. For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened. If a son shall ask bread of any of you that is a father, will he give him a stone? or if he ask a fish, will he for a fish give him a serpent? Or if he shall ask an egg, will he offer him a scorpion? If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children: how much more shall your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him? (Luk 11:9-13)
</blockquote>The last passage addresses exactly this question of receiving a wrong spirit. Based on these words of Jesus, I can be confident, that my heavenly Father will not give me a deceiving spirit, but the Holy Spirit. John gives further guidance warning Christians, that they must be discerning:
<blockquote>Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world. Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God: And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world. (1Jo 4:1-3)
</blockquote>
Quote:Have you ever seen Pentacostals doing their thing? Are you going to tell me that is the result of Jesus and not their own mind working themselves into a religious frenzy? Their "being filled with the holy spirit" is more akin to demonic possession and influece, when compared with buddhist styles of meditation, and even other "pagan" spiritual practices that involve communing with non-physical entities.
Have you ever visited a Pentecostal Church? Or have you only seen the often distorted view portrayed on secular TV or by the Televangelists? Regarding Pentecostals (Pente- not Penta-), I believe, that God poured out his Holy Spirit on the day of Pentecost and promised various gifts and activities of the Holy Spirit which will be experienced by disciples of Jesus Christ (see Acts Ch. 2 & 1Cor 12): Visions and dreams, various unknown languages, discernment, healing, prophecy, wisdom etc. I have witnessed genuine expressions of most of these in various churches.

But, especially in the last twelve years many Pentecostal/Charismatic churches have abandoned the need to discern spirits and have unquestioningly accepted whatever spiritual manifestation as coming from the Holy Ghost. Additionally many have not been taught the biblical Gospel message, therefore producing many unconverted nominal 'Christians' (see The Tv-evangelists' Gospel Is Not In The Bible!). This has led to terrible confusion and deception in those churches. Maybe you have seen some of this and rightly discerned it as 'akin to demonic possession and influence'. This does not negate the true manifestations of the Holy Ghost which were also promised by Jesus:
<blockquote>And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned. And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues; They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover. (Mar 16:15-18) </blockquote>
'Prove and scrutinize all things; hold fast that which is good.'
'And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather expose them.' Paul of Tarsus

Rise to a higher plane? Look here
Reply
10-31-2006, 05:09 AM, (This post was last modified: 10-31-2006, 05:14 AM by deathstickboy.)
#78
The New Age - A Pathway To Paradise
Quote:Have you ever visited a Pentecostal Church? Or have you only seen the often distorted view portrayed on secular TV or by the Televangelists? Regarding Pentecostals (Pente- not Penta-), I believe, that God poured out his Holy Spirit on the day of Pentecost and promised various gifts and activities of the Holy Spirit which will be experienced by disciples of Jesus Christ (see Acts Ch. 2 & 1Cor 12): Visions and dreams, various unknown languages, discernment, healing, prophecy, wisdom etc. I have witnessed genuine expressions of most of these in various churches.

Oh yes, many times. Most of my mother's side of the family was drawn in by the Pentacostal Church, I was raised a Lutheran, only because my mother remarried after divorcing my father, and Pentacostals don't allow divorce, so we had to go to a church that was not so backwards and fundamentalist as Pentacostals tend to be. (this leads to a good deal of battered women being unable to leave their husbands as well, but we don't talk about that now, do we ;))

I did however, attend many Pentacostal services, as well as a summer camp when I was 14, which was where I personally witnessed people working themselves into fits of religious exstacy, and some other interesting phenomena. I also heard many stories from my family members, who attended huge Pentacostal arena gatherings, in which a particularly good hypnotist (Preacher) would do all sorts of wonderful feats like faith healing, "filling the first 20 rows with the Holy Spirit" and simillar things. Of course, you will deny that such people are infact using hypnosis in their services, but that would only show that you haven't studied it much at all.

Quote:Visions and dreams
I have/had "visions" and dreams of the future (that come true) and so do many of my family members, regardless of weather or not "the holy spirit" is believed to be granting them, they occur.

Quote:various unknown languages
You mean people babbling gibberish? Or possibly channeling some entity? If its an "unknown language" how do you know its not gibberish? Because "it really sounds like it could be a language"? :LOL:

Quote:discernment
Like what? I have never seen anyone excercising discernment while "filled with the Holy Spirit" maybe you could be more specific. In theory this would be the sort of thing exercised while in a rational and normal state of mind, not a state of religious exstacy.

Quote:healing
Faith healing = placebo effect/the power of the human creature to heal its self. Most illnesses begin and end in the mind, and the power of the human mind is often underestimated, but nothing of that sort requires the "personal intervention" of that which is responsible for existence itself.

Quote:prophecy, wisdom etc.

People can prophesy all they want, but have you ever seen these prophecies come true?
How do you know its not just a bunch of bullshit, or more deception along the lines of the "Channelling" that goes on in New Age circles. Do you have any rational explanations or defences for that, or is it just more blind faith?

Back to speaking in tounges for just one second. According to the story, the Apostles spoke to people who then understood the apostles words in their own language, and vice versa. That is what "speaking in tounges" was and to me it sounds more like some form of telepathy, than a bunch of muttering gibberish that NO ONE can understand, including the person speaking it.

Quote:The last passage addresses exactly this question of receiving a wrong spirit. Based on these words of Jesus, I can be confident, that my heavenly Father will not give me a deceiving spirit, but the Holy Spirit. John gives further guidance warning Christians, that they must be discerning:

Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world. Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God: And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world. (1Jo 4:1-3)

So how do you test the spirits? My discernment told me that those Pentacostals were working themselves into fits of religious exstacy (which is fine with me, though I wish they would see it for what it is) but also leaving themselves completely open to the influence of whatever local entities might be around, not all of them friendly. This ignorant and uncontrolled behavior, in an energetic sense, is dangerous, more dangerous then eastern meditation, and chi-kung in terms of attracting and making ones self available to be influenced by spirits.

Its also interesting to note that people who engage in this behavior, sometimes become possessed.
Wyrd bi∂ ful aræd : Vituð ér enn eða hvat?
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
[Image: madwolfoy0.jpg][Image: sharksmall1kd6.jpg][Image: bearkodiakchugachfe7.jpg]
Reply


Possibly Related Threads...
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  The "Paradise Lost" Conspiracy. thealienyoucallgod 5 1,118 03-06-2013, 10:41 PM
Last Post: thealienyoucallgod

Forum Jump:


Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)