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There Is No Global Warming
03-15-2007, 08:26 AM,
#61
There Is No Global Warming
Yes there are issues with certain toxic pollutants that will harm the ecosystem. DU, PCB's GM foods excess pharmaceuticals entering the waste systems, oil slicks etc. Anyway...

Back to global warming. Maybe I missed something in this thread, but I am wondering why is it bad that the temperature of the Earth rises? Really. Why?


Here is an interesting link: http://www.ecofascism.com/article2.html


I agree with harflimon: "You think we make a big impact. Arrogant human. The atmosphere about 4.4 billion years ago was primarily CO2, water vapor and carbonates."


I don't agree with all of this but I do get some chuckles:

"We're so self-important. So self-important. Everybody's going to save something now. "Save the trees, save the bees, save the whales, save those snails." And the greatest arrogance of all: save the planet. What? Are these fucking people kidding me? Save the planet, we don't even know how to take care of ourselves yet. We haven't learned how to care for one another, we're gonna save the fucking planet? I'm getting tired of that shit. Tired of that shit. I'm tired of fucking Earth Day, I'm tired of these self-righteous environmentalists, these white, bourgeois liberals who think the only thing wrong with this country is there aren't enough bicycle paths. People trying to make the world safe for their Volvos. Besides, environmentalists don't give a shit about the planet. They don't care about the planet. Not in the abstract they don't. Not in the abstract they don't. You know what they're interested in? A clean place to live. Their own habitat. They're worried that some day in the future, they might be personally inconvenienced. Narrow, unenlightened self-interest doesn't impress me.

Besides, there is nothing wrong with the planet. Nothing wrong with the planet. The planet is fine. The PEOPLE are fucked. Difference. Difference. The planet is fine. Compared to the people, the planet is doing great. Been here four and a half billion years. Did you ever think about the arithmetic? The planet has been here four and a half billion years. We've been here, what, a hundred thousand? Maybe two hundred thousand? And we've only been engaged in heavy industry for a little over two hundred years. Two hundred years versus four and a half billion. And we have the CONCEIT to think that somehow we're a threat? That somehow we're gonna put in jeopardy this beautiful little blue-green ball that's just a-floatin' around the sun?

The planet has been through a lot worse than us. Been through all kinds of things worse than us. Been through earthquakes, volcanoes, plate tectonics, continental drift, solar flares, sun spots, magnetic storms, the magnetic reversal of the poles...hundreds of thousands of years of bombardment by comets and asteroids and meteors, worldwide floods, tidal waves, worldwide fires, erosion, cosmic rays, recurring ice ages...And we think some plastic bags, and some aluminum cans are going to make a difference? The planet...the planet...the planet isn't going anywhere. WE ARE!

We're going away. Pack your shit, folks. We're going away. And we won't leave much of a trace, either. Thank God for that. Maybe a little styrofoam. Maybe. A little styrofoam. The planet'll be here and we'll be long gone. Just another failed mutation. Just another closed-end biological mistake. An evolutionary cul-de-sac. The planet'll shake us off like a bad case of fleas. A surface nuisance.

You wanna know how the planet's doing? Ask those people at Pompeii, who are frozen into position from volcanic ash, how the planet's doing. You wanna know if the planet's all right, ask those people in Mexico City or Armenia or a hundred other places buried under thousands of tons of earthquake rubble, if they feel like a threat to the planet this week. Or how about those people in Kilowaia, Hawaii, who built their homes right next to an active volcano, and then wonder why they have lava in the living room.

The planet will be here for a long, long, LONG time after we're gone, and it will heal itself, it will cleanse itself, 'cause that's what it does. It's a self-correcting system. The air and the water will recover, the earth will be renewed, and if it's true that plastic is not degradable, well, the planet will simply incorporate plastic into a new pardigm: the earth plus plastic. The earth doesn't share our prejudice towards plastic. Plastic came out of the earth. The earth probably sees plastic as just another one of its children. Could be the only reason the earth allowed us to be spawned from it in the first place. It wanted plastic for itself. Didn't know how to make it. Needed us. Could be the answer to our age-old egocentric philosophical question, "Why are we here?" Plastic...asshole.

So, the plastic is here, our job is done, we can be phased out now. And I think that's begun. Don't you think that's already started? I think, to be fair, the planet sees us as a mild threat. Something to be dealt with. And the planet can defend itself in an organized, collective way, the way a beehive or an ant colony can. A collective defense mechanism. The planet will think of something. What would you do if you were the planet? How would you defend yourself against this troublesome, pesky species? Let's see... Viruses. Viruses might be good. They seem vulnerable to viruses. And, uh...viruses are tricky, always mutating and forming new strains whenever a vaccine is developed. Perhaps, this first virus could be one that compromises the immune system of these creatures. Perhaps a human immunodeficiency virus, making them vulnerable to all sorts of other diseases and infections that might come along. And maybe it could be spread sexually, making them a little reluctant to engage in the act of reproduction.

Well, that's a poetic note. And it's a start. And I can dream, can't I? See I don't worry about the little things: bees, trees, whales, snails. I think we're part of a greater wisdom than we will ever understand. A higher order. Call it what you want. Know what I call it? The Big Electron. The Big Electron...whoooa. Whoooa. Whoooa. It doesn't punish, it doesn't reward, it doesn't judge at all. It just is. And so are we. For a little while."

-George Carlin


MMM
Give me the judgment of balanced minds in preference to laws every time. Codes and manuals create patterned behavior. All patterned behavior tends to go unquestioned, gathering destructive momentum.
- Darwi Odrade
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03-17-2007, 03:27 PM,
#62
There Is No Global Warming
what the fuck has old + dying scientists, who are little freeer to tell the truth, have to do with what ever i might put in my lungs ???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????//ephilution
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03-17-2007, 03:45 PM,
#63
There Is No Global Warming
rockclimber i noticed that in the g.g.w.swindle doco some of the scientists were looking like they were dying and on morphine and that they were free to speak because they didn`t need to apply for funding since they were going out of this world.just an observation mind you .and please do check out the neutron monitoring websites from non english countries if you want a straight look at the heat debate.solar heating,,, global dimming,,,solar heating,,, global dimming,,,solar heating,,, global dimming,,,solar heating,,, global dimming,,,solar heating,,, global dimming,,,
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03-17-2007, 05:07 PM,
#64
There Is No Global Warming
Global warming is real, here is the proof......
[Image: GlobalWarming.jpg]
I always thought there might be a lot of cash in starting a religion-George Orwell
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03-19-2007, 11:56 PM,
#65
There Is No Global Warming
Is the earth heating up? yes. Is it because of cars and the like? Not likely, Intellekt watch "The Great Global Warming Swindle" then come back and tell us that global warming is caused by Co2. There was a period between the 1940s and 1970s or so that we had lots of industrial waste entering the atmosphere and the earth actually cooled down during that period. It's warming up again now not because of Co2 but because it's the earth's natural cycle. All this doom and gloom bullshit is just that, bullshit and hype. Don't buy the hype, do some research outside of mainstream sources and find out what's actually going on, then if you still believe in global warming, well that's your prerogative.
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03-22-2007, 03:10 PM,
#66
There Is No Global Warming
Quote:"Why are we here?" Plastic...asshole.

george carlin is the man.
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03-23-2007, 01:23 PM,
#67
There Is No Global Warming
Has anyone seen this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PFSvrUR6ftA...ted&search=

Al Gore's Nightmare; Global Warming Myth Exposed
I'm lumping together various information concerning law (the illusion of control through words) here: http://honesty.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=59
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03-24-2007, 07:10 PM,
#68
There Is No Global Warming
Quote:i do believe a lot of global warming is caused by us. and nothing can change my mind about that.
i just don't see how you guys think gas is good for the air
and say it in a"everything is okie dokie" mentality. you guys seriously don't
see how we're raping our planet?

Pull your head out of your arse.

If global warming is sush a dire threat why are the second and third LARGEST producers of co2 exempt? (China and India, respectively)

Why not pick on the top 10 producers if the threat is so big?
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03-24-2007, 07:11 PM,
#69
There Is No Global Warming
Yeah yeah yeah. Global Warming is a scam I know it and none of you green fascists are gonna change my mind.

Now I know the science and now I know the argument. No one on here or anywhere else had proved at all that this scam is based on reality.

Go and spread these "political" lies somewhere else. I'm sick of it man, you all are gonna be saying over population is a problem next. And that we have to cull half of the world population - don't buy it.

But if you do, go and live in a tent and don't fart as it may cause serious global instability...
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03-25-2007, 02:33 PM,
#70
There Is No Global Warming
Cheers Mad,

Here is another video by the same guy:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bM1yuRVC2s0...ser&search=

And here is one of his websites, where you can download the powerpoint presentation.
I'm lumping together various information concerning law (the illusion of control through words) here: http://honesty.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=59
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03-25-2007, 06:51 PM,
#71
There Is No Global Warming
Oopps, forgot to paste his web address:

http://www.stopdumbingdown.com/
I'm lumping together various information concerning law (the illusion of control through words) here: http://honesty.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=59
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03-26-2007, 08:09 PM,
#72
There Is No Global Warming
Quote:i just don't see how you guys think gas is good for the air

absolutely hilarious, what with your choice of name and everything, thankyou!:)
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03-27-2007, 01:27 AM,
#73
There Is No Global Warming
When you mention scientists who are attempting to raise doubts about the credibility of global warming theories, be aware that these scientists are often supported by the petroleum industry. Independent, academic, peer-reviewed researchers agree that global warming is occurring. I have access to academic libraries and information that can not find by surfing the Internet. Many of your comments like “no self-respecting scientist will look you in the eye and say global warming is occurring” are ridiculous and wrong. Beyond being inaccurate, a statement like that is a logical fallacy. Rarely, is every person of any organization in complete agreement. However, most reputable scientists are in agreement that global warming is occurring. I consider the fifty-two Nobel laureates, among others, to be reputable scientists.

If you remember back to February 2004, the Cambridge Massachusetts-based Union of Concerned Scientists (UCS) announced that more than sixty leading scientists, among them twenty Nobel laureates, had signed a statement denouncing the administration of George W. Bush for misrepresenting and suppressing scientific information and for tampering with the process by which scientific advice makes its way to government officials. Examples include distorting the science of climate change, quashing government scientific reports, and stacking scientific panels. Eventually fifty-two Nobel laureates, sixty-three national Medal of Science recipients, and 175 members of the National Academy of Sciences, along with thousands of others, signed the document.

Earlier, I stated that scientists who are attempting to raise doubts about the credibility of global warming theories are backed by the petroleum industry. The following quote is taken from the journal The Humanist which cites public statements by scientists and politicians. “The petroleum industry has spent a great deal of money setting up think tanks and sponsoring "contrarian" scientists far outside the mainstream to raise doubts about global warming and its causes. No one has been more supportive of these industry efforts than Senator James Inhofe (R-OK), a leading figure on environmental issues as recent chairman of the Environmental and Public Works Committee. It was Inhofe who went all out to defeat Senators John McCain (R-AZ) and Joseph Lieberman's (D-CT) Climate Stewardship Act, which would have created the first caps on greenhouse gas emissions ever agreed to by the U.S. government. He succeeded, in part, by stacking a Senate panel with climate science contrarians.” (Huebner, 2007).

This largely Republican attack on science goes far beyond directly threatening human health and wellbeing. It strikes at the enormous value that science itself has as an objective way of obtaining knowledge. With enough education from research heavy college institutions, students gradually come to realize that science is far more objective than religion or politics. I am not saying that scientists themselves are not biased, but I am saying that the scientific community is far less biased than big business interests and the interests of politicians. For more than two decades, beginning with the Reagan administration and then the Newt Gingrich Congress, influential Republicans in cahoots with allies in private industry and the religious right have systematically denied, disparaged, or misrepresented scientific information on topics relevant to public policy.


Isn’t it obvious that the petroleum industry and the political parties that back these industries, as well as cater to the religious right, would try to denounce the human affect on global warming? Science is an important part of our world precisely because it offers an objective, rather than a hopelessly biased, way of understanding reality. In standing up for science we encourage a greater acceptance of this approach. And when the public unshackles itself from dogma it takes an important step toward the realization that when decisions are informed by science, both the individual and society are better served.

Also, even if you can not seem to wrap your mind around the fact that human beings may have an effect on rising temperatures, it is obvious that old growth forests help clean out ground water. Do human being have an effect on air quality and water quality? You bet we do! Do old growth forests help our air and water? Yes, they do!
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03-27-2007, 04:04 AM,
#74
There Is No Global Warming
Well than avery, how about you post up that information for us? You seem to like rhetoric, but you are ambiguous in your attacks. Just because you say "Most scientists against global warming are in Big Oils backpocket" doesn't make that statement true and it certainly doesn't prove that the scientists quoted in this thread are involved with Big Oil.

Also I think there has been enough evidence shown in this thread to say that Global Warming advocates are just as entrenched with the Left and Democrats as non-GW scientists are with the right. This issue has been politicized, but when you get down to the science of it I don't think there is proof at all that humans are creating Global Warming. And until you decide to disprove me with your "non-internet" sources I will have no other choice than to disregard your point.

P.S. Why would the religious right be against Global Warming? Don't they want an apocalyptic future to prove their prophecies of Revelations?
The belief in 'coincidence' is the prevalent superstition of the Age of Science.

&I don't understand why you're taking such a belligerant tone when you're obviously the ignorant one here. &
-triplesix
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03-27-2007, 04:43 AM, (This post was last modified: 03-27-2007, 04:58 AM by Phil999.)
#75
There Is No Global Warming
thank you for your science-backed comment, Avery.

I think that the whole debate started long ago, since the creation of the "greenhouse"-theory. Besides the global-warming-theory, the greenhouse-theory is worldwide accepted since then. As a non-scientist, I still have problems to understand the old greenhouse-theory, because I think that the earth's atmosphere is not working like a greenhouse, and also because I still fail to see the proof that carbondioxide was a greenhouse gas.

There is a general problem when we apply observations from the small (a closed system, a greenhouse) to the big (earth's atmosphere). Therefore, I doubted the greenhouse-theory since I heard of it in the 80's. By the way, I was a child then, with no scientific knowledge, but I doubted it because it seemed not logic to me. Later, when people talked about the greenhouse-effect, I did not say anything, because I agreed with them to reduce the burning of fossil fuels. Only recently I was alarmed when I heard of the EU study and the Al Gore-film.

I always have to ask the same question. Why does nobody remember the coming ice age of the 70's? I was even a smaller child then, but I remember it clearly enough to know that it was serious. My father told me (he read scientific articles) that in a few decades we would face a new ice age. And my father was not joking. So, I believed in the coming ice age, and tried to prepare myself and plan my future according to this fact. But after some years passed by, I completely lost my trust in the scientific community, because they failed in various ways (medicine, advanced physics, hydrology, just to name the departments where I had personal bad experience), and I had to find the answers for my questions myself.

I was engaged with a scientist (her special department was hydrology. She did not know anything about vortexes, although water flows only in vortexes, not in linear currents), and found out that our universities do not teach real science. Our universities teach industry-applicable technology, which is fine and a good thing, but they teach not proper science.

So this global warming-theory is just a theory which is false, and it is spread around the world because nobody does real research, everybody (with only a few exceptions) copies what the other has copied. And scientific magazines publish what has been copied several times, which then becomes "scientifically proven". Our contemporary science is a charade and future generations will be full of shame when they must realize that.

I agree with you that the internet is not a valuable source of information, that we better should look into scientific libraries. But there we may find the same falseness as we know it from the internet.

EDIT: I forgot the political side. The future is again said to be nuclear energy. Remember, in the 50's we were told that in the year 2000 there will be everything nuclear-driven. Cars, airplanes, space-ships, the toaster, the heating. The global warming discussion advocates nuclear energy, that's the point. True scientists who dare to deny the global warming-theory are certainly not paid by the oil industry. The oil industry knows that their time is running out, so they need to change to radioactive fuel, which wouldn't be accepted by the people just like that. The nuclear industry need the global warming-theory.

Above that all, what really counts, is the centralized energy supply. An industry can only "survive" (that means being in control of the prices for decades) with centralized energy supply. Look at the electricity grid. They built it up, and they want to maintain it, preferably forever. What they don't want is a decentralized energy supply, which in fact is the real future for our societies. Centralized or decentralized power supply, that's what's it all about, not fossil or nuclear, or care of environment or global warming. It's about money and control, simple as it is.
I am my savior
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