The Kiddies Keeping The Holocaust Myth Alive [Warning: Load Times]

[Anarchist]

[Shinobi]

Awful first post Rachel. Cheers

[Negentropic]

Quote: Anarchist wrote:

And pointing that out makes me an anti-semite because of..... Oh yeah, the 1/2/4/6/10/15/whateverisnext million poor Jewish souls killed. Who cares about Polish scum, or Les Frogs, or those damn Yankees, the stupid Commies from the north. Only the Jews matter. Enough of that little rant.

Now, there were no gas chambers. Zlyklon-B (Not sure if I spelled it right, spell check would prefer Klondike-B), the gas they claim, was never found, and it stains substances blue. No blue gas rooms. Do not get me wrong, they killed a lot of people, and they did target Jews a bit (so they could use it as a pretext to set up the Rothschild state of Israel). Check out the Israeli Supreme Court financed by the Rothschilds, crazy symbolism. But the whole thing was not just against Jews.

They gave the prisoners a shower (cleaned and prepared them), then killed them, and burned them. Most burnings took place at midnight. It was a giant Satanic sacrifice. We don't care about Russia, because they were not Jews (but Stalin, Trotsky, and Lenin, as well as most the heads of the USSR [over 70%] were Jewish), nor about Mao Tse Tung and his 60m+ deaths caused. They also were not giant Satanic sacrifices, just democide.

Not to mention (as others have pointed out) that Hitler was partly Jewish, and a lot of the top SS people were Jews too.

I don't know where you get some of this bogus information from but there is no such thing as 'history' through completely unreliable eyewitness testimony, conjecture and 'crazy symbolism,' there is only history through documented period facts. It is only when a historian discovers the documented proofs, often from multiple sources, that this or that eyewitness testimony and / or symbolism is validated and not until then. All theories and 'testimony' that are directly contradicted by documented proof become MYTHS & FABLES. You are debunking the holycost here only to continue pushing other fables about Hitler and the NSDAP long since contradicted with proof.



Demystification of the Birth and Funding of the NSDAP
Veronica Kuzniar Clark

http://www.inconvenienthistory.com/archi..._nsdap.php

What exactly did the NSDAP (National Socialist German Worker's Party) represent and who were its founding members? Why and how did Adolf Hitler transform the party from an unimpressive proletariat workers’ party to a full-fledged political machine that obtained absolute power in Germany? Perhaps more important, how was it funded? We answer these questions in this introduction. But first, we begin with an examination of the early stages of the NSDAP and its recruiting process. One must understand how this process unfolded if one is to understand the NSDAP’s position on Judaism and Freemasonry as well as the prevailing social and political order of the day. Naturally, we also reveal some of the other important aspects of its early development, which necessitates a fair amount of myth busting about Hitler, including who actually gave him money.

Triumvirate: Leadership, development and unity

Adolf Hitler, contrary to his own self-myths and the myths of others, was not poor—at least not until he had drained his savings and entitlements gallivanting in Vienna. Many historians have written that Hitler simply lived day-to-day wasting both his money and time, but in so doing they overlook Hitler’s experiences and ‘life education’ that later played such an important role in the development and direction of National Socialism as well as the Second World War. The development and direction of both can be traced to Hitler’s experiences during those “lost” years.

Hitler, like so many other young German men and women of his day, fell from middle-class status into that of the “wretched proletariat.” This was something that young Hitler refused to accept. He was deeply embittered by his Vienna experiences, which offered false promises of prosperity and hope for young people with enough willpower and talent. The prevailing dissonance of the time and place in which he grew up inculcated in him a burning desire to change these circumstances, which is precisely what he did after 1933. Hitler was so resentful of the class-ridden society that was Vienna, and Austria and Europe generally, that one of his key aims throughout both the peace and war years was cultivating a system of merit. One’s birth station was not what mattered. What mattered were one’s talent, loyalty, dependability and fortitude, notably in the face of adversity and uncertainty. Hitler was able to overcome most imbedded class barriers in two distinct ways:

1. He recruited both men and women from all social classes and accordingly tailored his speech and disposition to each, depending on his/her social standing.

2. He supplanted economic valuation with racial valuation.

Let’s look at the first point. Hitler needed the broadest spectrum of German society he could get, so this meant that he needed to appeal to men, women, young, old, wealthy, poor, unemployed and employed alike. Women were amongst Hitler’s most devoted and fervent supporters in the early years. So were low-wage earners, small businessmen and foreign nobles, such as White Russian émigrés who wished to see the return of the Russian monarchy. They provided Hitler with a physical audience, elite and business connections and monetary support, most of which ended up being granted in the form of loans. Hitler needed industrialists as much as he needed the workers, elites and disenfranchised foreigners. Since his goal was to raise the station of all lower-class ethnic Germans, he had to win them all together, which required a strategy of multi-class appeal. When he met and spoke with counts, duchesses and other members of the former royalty, he addressed them in a royal manner. His etiquette, speech and personal manners proved impeccable in such company. When he met or spoke with industrialists, such as Fritz Thyssen, he tailored his behavior and manner to match that of the hopes and fears of industrialist Germany. At the same time he was careful to scale back his socialistic language in such company, so that the industrialists would not misidentify him as a Marxist-Communist. He had to convince them that he would crush Marxist-Communism and uphold their industrial power base in the face of the growing mass of disenchanted, underpaid workers who felt they were being cheated and exploited by German industry. Whenever things got economically tough, the workers suffered wage and benefit cuts. They blamed the industrialists, but Hitler saw that the industrialists were also suffering: many went bankrupt during the inflation as well as during the Great Depression. The crippling Versailles reparations forced most German industrialists and exporters into an untenable economic position, which in turn harmed German workers. This meant that Hitler had to at least hint at future German rearmament, which was covertly occurring anyway. On the other hand, Hitler had to promise the workers, his single largest and most important support base in almost every respect in the formative years, that he would not allow the state or industry to exploit them or continue treating them as automatons. We can see that balancing the wants and needs of these three core sectors of class-ridden Germany was far from simple. But Hitler did it, and nearly bloodlessly (relative to the Communist revolutions in Russia and throughout Eastern Europe).

Now to the second point: Hitler had to come up with a unifying ideology for Germanic peoples. This task seems simple in retrospect, because Germany was a homogenous society by today’s standards. However, back then this was not how the German situation was seen. Germany may have been racially homogenous, but class antagonisms were so deep-seated that few if any German elites and nobles were interested in sharing political or social power with lower-class and middle-class Germans. The Junkers (estates Lords) treated their farmhands (serfs) as second- or third-class citizens and ordered them to pack up and get out if they dared to vote against their landlord employers. According to James and Suzanne Pool's research, many of the Junkers, notably the friends of von Hindenburg, refused to discontinue living the feudal order, which helped fuel the growing mass discontent for monarchy. This only served the interests of republicans and Freemasons, both of whom wished to see the end of monarchy for good. We will discuss their motivations later. For now it is enough to say that their motives were far from benevolent. German class divisions trumped any sort of racial or ethnic solidarity. Not surprisingly, one finds that the desire to unite all Germans as racial comrades was a desire shared almost entirely amongst the lower and middle classes, and even many middle-class Germans did everything they could to cling to their bourgeois life station, even if it meant keeping the lower-classes downtrodden. As one can see, Hitler’s goal was anything but simple.

How, then, did Hitler unite Germans? And how successful was he? Hitler united Germans by invoking an ideological concept similar to Italy’s Romanita, as espoused by Benito Mussolini. Hitler’s concept was Nordicism: the basic, simplified premise of which was that all Germanic peoples were united by their Nordic racial component, and because they were united by this common “race soul” or blood component, how could they fight or be divided? While such a unifying idea sounded feasible and reasonable to many, some resisted nonetheless. The Junkers, former nobility, and many other business elites in Germany saw Hitler as nothing other than a lowly former corporal who had no clout given his petit bourgeois (lower middle-class) upbringing. Hitler was only partially successful in uniting all Germans as Volksgenossen. His lack of complete success in this regard, an unattainable goal to be sure, later proved to be his undoing. Elites amongst the officer corps did immeasurable damage to Hitler and his war effort, but the story of their treachery and sabotage is beyond the scope of this discussion.

Might Hitler have been more successful had he been more racially inclusive early on? Not necessarily. Mussolini, unlike Hitler, was not racially exclusive at any point and expended a great deal of effort and time attempting to recruit non-Italians to the Italian fascist cause. He was largely unsuccessful, especially in Ethiopia—this in spite of the fact that he had Ethiopians trained as pilots (before the Tuskegee Airmen even came into being) and promised them higher status within a Fascist Italian Empire. We may deduce from this example that Hitler having merely extended his hand openly in the beginning to non-Germans would not have guaranteed National Socialism’s political or military success. Mussolini did so and his tolerant hand was rejected. Indeed the U.S. and Britain did not win the Second World War due to non-white conscription, but because they supported and funded the Soviet war machine and were willing to bomb Germany indiscriminately. Anyway, this brings us back to our main point, which is that unifying a body of people, regardless of whether it is homogenous or diverse, is no easy task. Hitler was only able to convince the lower and middle classes that racial value must supersede economic (class) value. Most of the German elites were never won over to his Nordicism.

Read the rest over here:

http://www.inconvenienthistory.com/archi..._nsdap.php





The Heretics’ Hour: Putting Hitler Myths to Rest

February 28, 2011

http://reasonradionetwork.com/_archive/V...110228.mp3


Carolyn Yeager discusses the real genealogy of Adolf Hitler, and the real relationship between Prescott Bush, Fritz Thyssen and National Socialism. Topics include:


“Hitler’s grandfather was a Rothschild” story was invented by an OSS employee during WWII;


“Hitler’s grandfather was a Jew named Frankenberger” story was invented by a condemned man;


Records show that Hitler’s grandmother was not in Vienna or Graz at the time she conceived her son;


There was a relationship between Prescott Bush and Fritz Thyssen and a relationship between Thyssen and the National Socialist Party. But there was no relationship between Bush and the NS Party;


There is no link between Bush-Harriman and Auschwitz labor.



The Heretics’ Hour: More Hitler Myths Put to Rest

March 7, 2011

http://reasonradionetwork.com/_archive/V...110307.mp3


Some of the common slanders directed at Adolf Hitler as a youth up to 1919 are corrected in the light of real evidence. Topics include:


Adolf Hitler’s father did not beat him;


Hitler was never a house painter;


An inheritance from his parents allowed him a decent lifestyle;


He was fairly successful from 1910-1914 at selling his paintings;


He was particular about his appearance and dressed well;


He was not a “Red” but an education and political agent for the new Reichswehr after the Freikorps liberated Munich in 1919.



Charles Giuliani - The Truth Hertz - September 14, 2011 Interview with Veronica Clark of inconvenienthistory.com


http://mp3.oraclebroadcasting.com/Truth_...14_16k.mp3



Some of the topics discussed and points made:

Lawrence Dennis' "A Trial on Trial"

Hitler realized at the onset of his war on international capitalism that it would be good political strategy to blame everything on the Jews since the moronic public mind was not capable of assimilating abstract ideas or developing indignation against the multiplicity and complexity of evils.

Democracy worked only while an aristocracy ruled

People should start with Britain and the United States before condemning Hitler for somehow not delivering on every single idea that they think he should have delivered on

Why did Hitler end up sending Jews to Palestine ? Why did he allow them into his military?

The National Socialists knew that it was going to be a huge problem to give the Jews a state. They realized that that would be a 'world supremacy' problem. They were trying to avoid this problem but no one would co-operate with them and especially Britain. This is in the Otto Wagner memoirs "Hitler, memoir of a confidant."

Rothschild was parked behind the Bank of England at the time. Why is it that Rothschild allowed the British to block the ships that Hitler was sending to Palestine with Jews on them if he was, in fact, the devout Zionist we say?

France told Hitler, you can't use any of our territories and colonies to relocate your Jews

Poland wanted to send them to Madagascar; America was also opposed

There is no proof whatsoever that Eichmann was either full or part Jewish. He was just a German that was working within the parameters of the immigration process

There are a lot of writers that weave in the fraudulent with the truthful information, they weave in the fraud with the legitimate info and do not site it or source it

The book "Adolf Hitler, founder of Israel" is about 90% fraud

There is such a large volume of fraudulent books that revisionists sometimes have to read 200 plus books before determining what the truth of just one particular event was. The plus side is that you get to a point where you can immediately identify fraud

The fatal errors in Sidney Warburg's fraudulent memoirs

There were Jews in the Nazi party but they identified more as Germans than Jews. Brian Rigg has done the best job of documenting who those people were.

There is no proof whatsoever that Alfred Rosenberg was Jewish

Hitler got oil from Mexico and Stalin


Fascists were slandered by every side to discredit them because they were doing very well.


When Hitler came to power there were 2500 private banks in Germany he was up against



Most of the claims about Hitler's tirades are nonsense as recorded in Otto Dietrich's memoirs among others. The Hitler I Knew: Memoirs of the Third Reich's Press Chief


The book "The Occult Roots of Nazism" is bunk. Hitler was never a freemason and told them to get out of his face when they did try to recruit him. Himmler and some upper SS members were into some occultism and history but the majority of the SS were still catholic. No evidence of any connection between National Socialists and Ordo Templi Orientis


Hitler was behind Hess. Britain refuses to open the Hess files.

Schacht, the Rothschild agent was dismissed by Hitler in 1937 and put under Gestapo surveillance for the rest of the war because he wouldn't go along with what Hitler wanted. He was later acquitted at Nuremberg because he was a Rothschild agent. Most of the rest of the German elite were murdered at Nuremberg.


Deanna Spingola / Veronica Clark - 06 / 21 / 2012


Kristallnacht - the myths and exaggerations vs. the historical reality


http://www.spingola.com/vclark6_2012-06-21_15-59-30.mp3




Adolf Hitler speech against freemasonry, illuminati, NWO, & zionist plutocratic warmongers England.






Hitler had only one goal with regard to his relations with other nations. That goal was peace. On May 17, 1933, Hitler addressed the Reichstag about his intentions:

"Germany will be perfectly ready to disband her entire military establishment and destroy the small amount of arms remaining to her, if the neighboring countries will do the same thing with equal thoroughness. Germany is entirely ready to renounce aggressive weapons of every sort if the armed nations, on their part, will destroy their aggressive weapons within a specified period, and if their use is forbidden by an international convention. Germany is at all times prepared to renounce offensive weapons if the rest of the world does the same. Germany is prepared to agree to any solemn pact of non-aggression because she does not think of attacking anybody but only of acquiring security."



The Hoax of the Twentieth Century by Arthur R. Butz can be read in its entirety here:

http://vho.org/aaargh/fran/livres3/HoaxV2.pdf




My vote for concen's best thread ever goes to:


Important Questions - An Analysis of the Holocaust Claims - by Konev

http://concen.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=15910
















Hitler was a great man and the Gestapo were fabulous police David Irving claims


http://concen.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=35132&page=3


Most of David Irving's books can be read for free online at his website:


Hitler's War by David Irving


http://fpp.co.uk/books/Hitler/2001/HW1.pdf


Nuremberg The Last Battle by David Irving


http://fpp.co.uk/books/Nuremberg/NUREMBERG.pdf


Apocalypse 1945: The Destruction of Dresden - David Irving


http://fpp.co.uk/books/Dresden/Apocalypse_2007.pdf


Goebbels, Mastermind of the Third Reich - David Irving


http://fpp.co.uk/books/Goebbels/Goebbels.pdf


The Secret Diaries of Hitler's Doctor - David Irving


http://fpp.co.uk/books/Morell/Morell.pdf


The Rise and Fall of the Luftwaffe - The Life of Field Marshal Erhard Milch - David Irving


http://www.fpp.co.uk/books/Milch/Milch.pdf


Goering, A Biography - David Irving


http://fpp.co.uk/books/Goering/Goering_2010.pdf


The Trail of the Fox, The Search for the True Field Marshal Rommel - David Irving


http://fpp.co.uk/books/Rommel/Rommel_2005_web.pdf


Hess: The Missing Years 1941-1945 - David Irving


http://fpp.co.uk/books/Hess/Hess_2010.pdf


The Mare's Nest, The Story of Hitler's V Weapons - David Irving


http://www.fpp.co.uk/books/MaresNest/MaresNest_2010.pdf


The War Between the Generals - David Irving


http://fpp.co.uk/books/WarBetween/2010_edition.pdf


Churchill's War Volume I: Struggle For Power - David Irving

http://www.fpp.co.uk/books/Churchill/1/index.html

Churchill's War Volume II: Triumph In Adversity - David Irving

http://www.fpp.co.uk/books/Churchill/2/index.html


http://fpp.co.uk/books/index.html





David Irving visits Hitler's secretary Christa Schroeder in 1976



Truth Hertz 07/ 11/2012 Charles Giuliani interviews Veronica Clark, author of Hitler & Himmler Uncensored


http://k005.kiwi6.com/hotlink/8j2k115lf4..._07_11.mp3


http://www.inconvenienthistory.com/index.php



Hitler was the guy most responsible for saving Germany from the International Butt-Rape Bankster Syndicate and the most loved leader in the history of Germany as attested to in their free elections. Which other political leader has ever received 98% of the votes in free elections ? Yes, the NSDAP did have dictatorial powers to clean house, but those powers were given to Hitler through FREE elections both times, 44% out of an 11 party race (not the joke of a two party system they have in the USA) the first time, and 98% in 1936 when Hitler not only delivered on most of his promises but exceeded them by leaps and bounds in what became known throughout the world as an 'economic miracle.'

Hitler's Germany was such a 'totalitarian' country that Austrians freely voted by a 99% majority to re-unify with Germany !

Quote: WITNESS TO HISTORY - by Michael Walsh - CHAPTER 4

HITLER, THE VOTE WINNER

75 Million Germans say "YES" to One Nation, One People, One Leader.


"No democratic Government in the world can submit itself to a popular vote in greater trust and with greater confidence than can the National Socialist Government of Germany." -- Adolf Hitler, 30th January, 1935.


The election on July, 31st, 1932 was a victory for the National Socialists. They polled 13,574,000 votes and with 38% of the total votes cast legitimately and democratically became the largest Party in the Reichstag with 230 seats. The Social Democrats had 133 seats and the Communists 89. On January 30th, Adolf Hitler was appointed Chancellor of Germany.


At the polls of March, 5th, the NSDAP polled 17,277,180 votes; an increase of 5.5 million bringing their voting percentage up to 44%, which when placed in coalition with the Nationalists led by Franz von Papen and Alfred Hugenberg who had polled 3,136,760 votes, showed an overwhelming majority of Germans had in free and open elections made their preference for German nationalism clear.


Immediately after his appointment as Chancellor, Adolf Hitler, in his first appeal to the German nation on February, 1st, 1933, asked to be allowed just four years in order to carry out the task of national reconstruction. He repeated the same request when a few days later, when at a speech in the Berlin Sportpalast, he said:


"During fourteen years the German nation has been at the mercy of decadent elements which have abused its confidence. During fourteen years those elements have done nothing but destroy, disintegrate and dissolve. Hence it is neither temerity nor presumption if, appearing before the nation today, I ask: German nation, give us four years time, after which you can arraign us before your tribunal and you can judge me!


"Allow me four years, and I swear to you, as truly as I have now undertaken my duties, I will depart. It is not for any reward or benefit that I have taken office, but only for your sake. It has been the greatest decision of my whole life.


"I cannot rid myself of my faith in my people, nor lose the conviction that this people will resuscitate again one day. I cannot be severed from the love of a people that I know to be my own. And I nourish the conviction that the hour will come when millions of men who now curse us will take their stand behind us to welcome the new Reich, our common creation born of a painful and laborious struggle and an arduous triumph -- a Reich which is the symbol of greatness, honour, strength, honesty and justice."


True to his word, on March 29th, 1936, the German nation was given as promised the opportunity to express their approval or disapproval of the National Socialist state. It was an entirely free election without fear or intimidation with adequate provision made for monitoring by neutral observers.


THE OUTCOME


TOTAL QUALIFIED VOTES: 45,453,691


TOTAL VOTES CAST: 45,001,489 (99%)


VOTES 'NO' OR INVALID: 540,211


VOTES FOR HITLER'S NSDAP: 44,461,278 (98.8%)


Small wonder that of all the books written and documentaries produced on the Third Reich, none dare to publish facts such as these. As someone wisely said; 'history is the propaganda of the victors.'


GOVERNMENT BY THE PEOPLE


The National Socialist electoral system was not based on the parliamentary system but was nonetheless democratic. Of the parliamentary system of government, Hitler was scathing:


" . . . a turbulent mass of people, all gesticulating and bawling against one another, with a pathetic old man shaking his bell and making frantic efforts to call the House to a sense of dignity by friendly appeals, exhortations and grave warnings. I could not refrain from laughing." -- Adolf Hitler, Mein Kampf, p.53
"Several weeks later I paid a second visit. This time the house presented an entirely different picture, so much so that one could hardy recognise it as the same place. The hall was practically empty. They were sleeping in the other rooms below. Only a few deputies were in their places, yawning in each other's faces. One was speechifying. A Deputy Speaker was in the chair. When he looked round it was plain that he felt bored." -- Adolf Hitler, Mein Kampf, p.53


"As a contrast to this kind of democracy we have the German democracy, which is a true democracy; for here a leader is freely chosen and is obliged to accept full responsibility for all his actions and omissions. The problems to be dealt with are not put to the vote of the majority; but they are decided upon by the individual, and as a guarantee of responsibility for those decisions he pledges all he has in the world and even his life." -- Adolf Hitler, Mein Kampf, p.61


The National Socialist system of government was largely based on referenda in which the really important issues of the day were debated and voted upon by the German people. When, for instance, Adolf Hitler felt it necessary to prove the German nation's sincerity in its peaceful intentions, he called for an election combined with a plebiscite (referendum) that stated:


"It is not for my own sake that I asked for this national vote, but for the sake of the German people. It is not I who require such a vote of confidence to strengthen and sustain me; it is the German people who require a Chancellor supported by such confidence before the world. For I am nothing my fellow-countrymen, but your mouthpiece, and do not wish to be anything but the representative of your life and the defender of your vital interests." -- Adolf Hitler.


"The German Government and the German nation are united in the sincere wish to examine and solve dispassionately, be means of negotiations, all pending questions with all other nations, including Germany's former adversaries. The German Government and the German nation are prepared to conclude long term continental pacts of non-aggression with the object of securing peace, the economic prosperity, and the general reconstruction of Europe." Adolf Hitler


This general election and plebiscite took place on November 12th, 1933. Of a total of 43,491,575 votes recorded, 40,632,628 were cast in favour of the Government, this being a majority of 95%.


HITLER THE VOTE WINNER (THE SAAR REGION)


The Versailles Treaty deprived Germany of the Saar territory, falsely claiming as justification that the region was historically French and with a French population of 150,000. In fact, the French population was just 2,000. For every French citizen in the Saar, there were 250 Germans.


On January, 13th, 1935, two years after the election of Adolf Hitler, free elections observed by international observers were held in which the electorate were asked whether they wished to remain as French citizens or would prefer to become part of the Third Reich.


IN FAVOUR OF UNIFICATION WITH GERMANY: 477,119


THOSE FAVOURING NO CHANGE: 46,513


IN FAVOUR OF REMAINING FRENCH: 2,124


There was a 90.5% majority in favour of reunification with Germany. Yet another election the propagandists choose to ignore for reasons transparent.


HITLER THE VOTE WINNER (AUSTRIA)


On March 13th, 1938, the Austrian Government enacted a constitutional law concerning a plebiscite for the reunion of Austria with the Third Reich. On 18th, March, 1938, Hitler dissolved the Reichstag and announced conformity with the plebiscite which was announced on April, 10th, 1938. The peoples of both nations were to be given the opportunity to decide for or against unification with Hitler's Germany.


AUSTRIA: THE RESULTS


ENTITLED TO VOTE: 4,474,138


ACTUAL VOTE: 4,460,778 (99.07%)


TOTAL VALID VOTES: 4,455,015


VOTES IN FAVOUR OF UNIFICATION: 4,443,208 (99.73%)


VOTES AGAINST UNIFICATION: 11,807


SPOILT PAPERS: 5,763


GERMANY: THE RESULTS


ENTITLED TO VOTE: 45,073,303


ACTUAL VOTE 44,872,702 (99.55%)


TOTAL VALID VOTES 44,803,096


VOTES IN FAVOUR OF UNIFICATION 44,362,667 (99.02%)


VOTES AGAINST UNIFICATION 440,429


SPOILT PAPERS 69,606


OBSERVATIONS:


"Most foreign observers present in Vienna that day accepted that the polling had been free from any open intimidations." (Gordon Brook-Shepherd. British writer)


"The crisis of March, 1938 (which led to the Anschluss) was provoked by Schuschnigg, the Austrian Chancellor, not by Hitler." (A.J.P. Taylor. British Historian)


"He (Chamberlain) had no difficulty in recognising where this injustice lay. There were six million Germans in Austria to whom national reunification was still forbidden by the Peace Treaties of 1919. Three million Germans in Czechoslovakia whose wishes had never been consulted; three hundred and fifty thousand people in Danzig who were notoriously German." (A.J.P. Taylor)


"The German Army was invading Austria, or rather was marching in to the general enthusiasm of the people." (A.J.P. Taylor)


"The pull of sentiment, language and history, reinforced by the material advantages offered by becoming part of a big nation, was strong enough to waken a genuine welcome when the frontier barriers went down and the German troops marched in garlanded with flowers . . . there was a widespread sense of relief, even amongst those who were far from being Nazis." (Alan Bullock. Historian)


"Chamberlain's conduct towards Germany . . . had never been dictated by a consciousness of military weakness but exclusively by the religious idea that Germany must have justice, and that the injustice of Versailles must be made good." (Prime Minister Chamberlain's Press Officer)


"It (Munich) was a triumph for all that was best and most enlightened in British life; a triumph for those who had preached equal justice between peoples, a triumph for those who had courageously denounced the harshness and the shortcomings of Versailles." (A.J.P. Taylor. The Origins of the Second World War)" Hitler had a plausible case to argue when he claimed that the Anschluss was only the application of the Wilsonian principle of self-determination." -- Alan Bullock


THE SUDETENLAND:


"The worst offence (of the Versailles Treaty) was the subjection of over three million Germans to Czech rule." (H.N. Brailsford. Leading Left-Wing Writer. 1920)


". .. in early 1939 the problem of Czechoslovakia -- the rump, polyglot state created at Versailles, comprising many central European ethnic populations -- continues to dominate European affairs. Hitler backs the aspirations for independence from the Czechs of the Slovaks, the biggest minority within the artificial Czech state." (Count Jerzy Potocki, Polish Ambassador)


Coincidentally, on the very day I include this relevant quotation (31st, January, 1993), 54 years on from the Fuhrer's recommendation, the Czech and Slovak people of their own free will took Hitler's advice and separated themselves from each other, amidst much rejoicing. During the same period (1939) Lord Halifax warned that Hitler intended to establish an independent Ukrainian state.


Is it not interesting that these paragons of the democratic process and signatories of the Atlantic Charter, who had set themselves up as the guarantors of small nations' independence, should have been so alarmed when that Czechs, Slovaks, Ukrainians and others too, opted for independence. How ironic also that this was Adolf Hitler's advice.


"There has never been a government in Germany which had a better right to claim that it represented the broad masses of the people than has the National Socialist Government. The elections held on November, 12th, 1933, when 95% of the valid votes recorded by the German people were given for Herr Hitler and his policy, proved that the German people unanimously back the German Government." Dr. Joseph Goebbels


THE ECONOMIC MIRACLE:


The following figures are typical of the increase in German production, progress and living standards between 1932 and 1937, and are taken from a three hour reported addressed by the German Chancellor.


"In 1932, before National Socialism acquired power, the German national income amounted to 45.2 milliard Reichsmarks. . . and in 1937 reached the round figure of 68 milliard Reichsmarks. In contrast to this increase in income the general cost of living index remained practically unchanged. In other words, while the national income increased by nearly 50% the increase in the general cost of living rose by only 4%."


Five years of National Socialist industrial and economic activity show that:


Paper manufacture has increased by 50%


The manufacture of diesel oil has increased by 66%


The production of coal has increased by 68%


The production of oil fuel has increased by 80%


The production of mineral oil has increased by 90%


The production of artificial silk has increased by 100%


The production of Kerosene has increased by 110%


The production of steel has increased by 167%


The production of lubricating oil has increased by 190%


"The production of petrol and other motor fuels increased by 470%. Aluminium production by 570% and the production of Zellwoille by 2,500%."


"We have been successful in increasing our foreign trade in imports from 4.2 to 5.5 milliard Reichsmarks and in exports from 4.9 milliard in 1933 to 5.9 milliard Reichsmarks in 1937."


"After the USA, Germany today is once more the leading steel producing country in the world." -- Adolf Hitler

THE FOLLOWING NUMBER OF VEHICLES WERE LICENSED:
(comparison between 1932 & 1937)

1932 / 1937

56,400 motorcycles / 234,000 motorcycles


41,100 motor cars / 216,000 motor cars


7,000 commercial vehicles / 50,600 commercial vehicles




"Whereas in 1937 roughly five times as many motor vehicles were licensed as in 1932, the export of motor cars has increased eightfold as compared with the same year."


"In 1932 German inland shipping conveyed 73.5 million tons which increased to 130 million tons in 1937."


"German ocean shipping conveyed 36 million tons in 1932 and 61 million tons in 1937. The idle tonnage that was laid up along the rivers Elbe and Weser and along the German coast has completely disappeared."


"German shipbuilding yards had orders for 22,000 tons in 1932. At present they have orders on hand for a total tonnage of 1,120,000 tons for merchant shipping alone."


ROADS:


"For the maintenance and development of German roads, including the super highways, the following sums have been spent:


1932: 440 million Reichsmarks


1933: 708 million Reichsmarks


1935: 1325 million Reichsmarks


1937: 1450 million Reichsmarks


". . . the displacement of earth by far exceeds the building achievement of the Panama Canal."


"The following large bridges were built. 6 bridges over the Rhine, 4 over the Elbe, 2 over the Oder, 3 over the Danube, 1 over the Weser, and 1 over the Pregel. In addition, 3,400 further bridges were built in connection with the super highways."


"Every year a thousand kilometres of motor-roads will be opened until the greatest work in the history of mankind is completed." (Adolf Hitler)


"340,000 houses were built in 1937 -- twice the number built in 1932. Altogether 1,400,000 houses have been put on the housing market since the National Socialists acquired power.


"In 1932, only 19 out of every 1,000 people in Germany owned cars as compared with 41 in France and 37 in Great Britain; today, however, the figure for Germany is 35 in every 1,000 as compared with 51 per 1,000 in France and Great Britain.


"Total industrial production in Germany is today 144% greater than in 1932. Even the peak year of 1929 was exceeded as early as 1936, while today about 30% more industrial goods are produced than in 1929. The production of capital goods has risen much more strongly than has the production of consumption goods, being now four times as great as in 1932 and more than one and a half times as great as 1929.


"Progress in the field of domestic raw material production has been even greater. Iron ore production has risen from an average of 843,000 metric tons for the first three months of 1932 to 1,226,000 metric tons in the first three months of 1938. This means an increase of 45%. Furthermore there has been great progress in domestic oil production. In 1938, staple fibre production has reached 155,000 metric tons as compared with 5,400 metric tons in 1933 and 102,000 metric tons in 1937." (Adolf Hitler)


"In the sphere of economic life all action must be governed by one law; capital serves industry, and industry serves the people." -- Adolf Hitler


"German economic salvation has been brought about solely through the efforts of the German people and the experience they have gained. Countries abroad have contributed nothing to this." -- Adolf Hitler


"Germany's economic salvation was due solely to the nation's own efforts under its own leadership." - Adolf Hitler


"We have made it possible, without gold and without foreign exchange, to maintain the value of the German mark. Behind the German mark stands the German capacity for work, while some foreign countries, suffocated by gold, have been compelled to devalue their currencies." (Adolf Hitler)


"Today in May, 1938, the world around us suffers from the anxiety which the unemployment of millions brings with it. In Germany we begin to be anxious because we have not enough workmen." (Adolf Hitler)


CRUSH THE COMPETITION:


Germany's reduced dependency upon imports and its phenomenal increase in productivity and exports provided Germany with an economic and social advantage with which neither Britain, the USA and the USSR could compete. Furthermore, severe social deprivation, the effect of the Great Depression, social unrest and economic uncertainty in these countries were in contrast to Germany which was experiencing an economic and social miracle. Germany had to be destroyed.


Hitler was well aware that Britain and America would seek to resolve their problem by initiating a trade war that would destroy Germany and grab its markets.


"The war was not just a matter of the elimination of Fascism in Germany, but rather of obtaining German sales markets." (Winston Churchill. Fulton. March 1946)


http://www.sweetliberty.org/issues/wars/...ory/5.html



German peasants crowd around Adolf Hitler's car to get a good view of their leader as he drives into Berchtesgaden September 9 1934 to give a speech in connection with the convention of the National Socialist Party

Deanna Spingola / Veronica Clark - 05/ 25/ 2012 - More lies about National Socialism exposed for the invented frauds they are. Himmler's Posen Speech of 10/24/1943, buried on microfiche for 60-plus years, rediscovered and analyzed


http://www.spingola.com/vclark6_2012-05-25_16-00-17.mp3


Deanna Spingola / Veronica Clark - 06/ 01/ 2012 - The Mengele myths, the homosexuality myths in the NSDAP, Project Monarch NSDAP connection myths deconstructed


http://www.spingola.com/vclark6_2012-06-01_16-00-25.mp3


Spingola Speaks 06 /07 / 2012 -- Deanna Spingola interviews Veronica Clark, author of the books Black Nazis I & II, Hitler and Himmler Uncensored & Triumph of Diversity: A New Look at Hitler's Armed Forces

Hess & Hitler's relationship to Britain; Churchill's Deception by Louis C. Kilzer


http://k005.kiwi6.com/hotlink/u9w8wwuoip..._06_07.mp3


Deanna Spingola / Zion Crime Factory - 06/08/2012 - the tailmud, the holohoax and the Israeli attack on the USS liberty


http://www.spingola.com/zioncrimefactory...-02-29.mp3


Deanna Spingola Special Broadcast: Thursday, 6/14/2012 : Veronica Clark - the Myth of the NSDAP starting the Reichstag Fire as a 'False-Flag' operation deconstructed in detail and absolutely demolished once-&-for-all


http://www.spingola.com/vclark6_2012-06-14_16-02-56.mp3


Deanna Spingola Interview Specials - 06/20/2012 - Zion Crime Factory - - the bovine excrement myths surrounding 'Not-see' involvement in founding the OSS and CIA and the 'Not-sees' being deliberately brought to the US in operation 'Paperclip' -


http://www.spingola.com/zioncrimefactory...-24-02.mp3


Spingola Speaks 05 / 17 / 2012 -- Deanna Spingola interviews Veronica Clark, author of the books Black Nazis I & II, Hitler and Himmler Uncensored & Triumph of Diversity: A New Look at Hitler's Armed Forces


http://k005.kiwi6.com/hotlink/4avhjvt00g..._05_17.mp3


Spingola Speaks 04 / 27 / 2012 -- Deanna Spingola interviews Veronica Clark, author of the books Hyenas of High Finance, The Union Jackal, Black Nazis I & II, Hitler and Himmler Uncensored & Triumph of Diversity: A New Look at Hitler's Armed Forces


http://k004.kiwi6.com/hotlink/g0u4j813eg..._04_27.mp3


Spingola Speaks 04 / 06 / 2012 -- Deanna Spingola interviews Veronica Clark, author of the books Black Nazis I & II, Hitler and Himmler Uncensored & Triumph of Diversity: A New Look at Hitler's Armed Forces


http://k003.kiwi6.com/hotlink/q3qj2lf0b2..._04_06.mp3


Spingola Speaks 03 / 09 / 2012 -- Deanna Spingola interviews Veronica Clark, author of the books Black Nazis I & II, Hitler and Himmler Uncensored & Triumph of Diversity: A New Look at Hitler's Armed Forces

http://k004.kiwi6.com/hotlink/137c1jpx45..._03_09.mp3


Adolf Hitler’s Armed Forces: A Triumph for Diversity? - Veronica Clark


http://www.inconvenienthistory.com/archi...forces.php


Non-Aryans and Jews in Hitler's Armed Forces, A photographic history:


http://www.scribd.com/doc/87390076/Nazi-...ive-Action


Here's a huge, loud, chanting and blood-thirsty demonstration against one German man in Canada. What did this one man do? Was he a child molester? Was he a serial killer? Did he shoot unarmed civilians on a humanitarian mission in international waters and murder them in cold blood? Did he run over an unarmed American girl with a bulldozer and back up and run over her again on camera, making sure she was dead ? Did he sell people's internal organs and refuse to pay them? No he just happened to present some facts about the massive, non-stop and all-permeating anti-German propaganda and demonization throughout the entire world's media:




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lM-bjvIX-o8

Here are actual recorded callers threatening to cut the balls off of and stab with an icepick in the stomach, the same polite German man, not to mention burn down his house and even rape his wife :




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ztAk7Xg1Llo

Jim Fetzer Interview with Ernst Zundel - August 03, 2012 -

http://nwopodcast.com/fetz/media/jim%20f...zundel.mp3

David Irving: Anti-German Propaganda Since WW2



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yGAUm-0DLiU


Truth Militia Radio with Rich & Keith - 09 / 30 / 2012 - Guest: Victor Thorn - Author of the book "The Holocaust Hoax Exposed - Debunking the 20th Century's Greatest Fabrication"

http://www.blogtalkradio.com/the-truth-m...s-news.mp3

http://wingtv.net/holocausthoax.html

http://wingtv.net/

Veronica Clark reads J. A. Sexton's review of Destined to Witness by Hans Massaquoi



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WlHHV762kM0&feature=plcp


Truth Militia Radio - John Friend Interviews Deanna Spingola - 10 / 30 / 2012 - topics: the holohoax; the amenities and facilities of the German work camps vs. Eisenhower's 200 German starvation death camps, the brutality of the Poles and Russians; the torture of Germans to get confessions at Nuremberg, etc.

http://www.blogtalkradio.com/the-truth-m...friend.mp3

[SirBustaBear]

Some interesting logical considerations regarding the reasoning of deniers of the Shoah:

Quote:Evincing the same sympathies as previous generations of deniers, Butz declared that the greatest tragedy was that the Germans and Austrians had been the real victims. He also showed the same antipathies as those who had preceded him. Describing Jews as among "the most powerful groups on earth," he argued that they possessed formidable powers to manipulate governments, control war crimes trials, govern the media, and determine other nations' foreign policy, all in the name of perpetrating the hoax of the twentieth century. According to Butz, Jews invented this hoax in order to further "Zionist ends.'' Thus one could extrapolate from Butz's argument that whatever antisemitism the Nazis displayed was well justified. This demonology, common to virtually every denier, is an affirmation of Nazi ideology. The Nazis depicted Aryans as the "master race" – strong and invincible. Jews, in contrast, were not human. Despite their superiority Aryans were considered highly vulnerable to Jewish conspiracies. The Jews' ability to create the hoax had [according to Butz] proven the Nazi thesis correct: They were a threat to the world.

[…]

Although Jews were the instigators, they engineered this effort with the assistance of other forces. Together they formed a vast conspiratorial network that, despite the broad assortment of groups involved, managed to keep its existence a secret. According to Butz all these vastly different forces were coordinated by Zionists, who nurtured the legend until it achieved the stature of an international, historical hoax. A complex and convoluted process that involved multitudinous forces, it remained undetected, amazingly, until a professor of electrical engineering conducted his own brand of historical research.

Butz's list of culpable parties is all-encompassing. He blames the "Zionist International" and the Communists as well as the U.S. government's War Refugee Board and Office of Strategic Services. In addition the New York-based research institute YIVO; U.S. government officials; the prosecutors and judges at the war crimes trials; Polish-Jewish "propagandists"; and Soviet officials all helped perpetrate this fraud, aided and abetted by the media and such international welfare organizations as the Red Cross.

Butz vacillated between holding Jews solely responsible for this "Jewish hoax" – which was also a "Zionist hoax" – and presenting it as the result of a cooperative effort in which Washington, London, Moscow , Jerusalem, and Jews everywhere had participated. Using their political power, Jews had amassed a broad array of allies, "official Washington" among them. It is noteworthy that those Jews who pressured Washington to cooperate in the hoax were the same ones who were unable to convince it during the prewar and war years to liberalize the immigration system, open its doors to the nine hundred Jews on the St. Louis, admit German Jewish refugee children, transport refugees on empty transport ships returning from Europe, or permit any more than a token number of Jews to enter the United States during the war itself. * Butz would have us believe that the same Jews whose rescue record was a dismal failure were somehow able to manipulate Washington into participating in this massive hoax.

According to Butz the key to perpetrating the hoax was the forging of massive numbers of documents, an act committed with the complicity of Allied governments. There was no shortage of people to assist in this endeavor: Hundreds of trained staff members were sent to Europe in the immediate aftermath of the war. They were responsible for "a fabrication constructed of perjury, forgery, distortion of fact and misrepresentation of documents." Without being discovered by anyone, they created reports by Einsatzgruppen commanders listing the precise cities in which massacres had been conducted and the exact numbers of men, women, and children who had been killed. They prepared documents purporting to be official communiqués from the highest-ranking offices of the Third Reich. Not only were they able to falsify and fabricate at will, but they even succeeded in planting the documents in the correct places so that those who were not part of the hoax would happen upon them. So complete was their control that they were able to determine whether the war crimes courts received genuine documents, forged documents, or no documents at all. They even created false recordings of speeches by Nazi leaders and inserted them into the materials collected by the liberating forces. Without their scheme being discovered and exposed by anyone, these hundreds of forgers – working in both Western and Eastern zones, and with the acquiescence of American, British, French, and Soviet officials – somehow managed, in an incredibly short space of time, to produce thousands of documents, all of which were designed to prove that the Nazis intended to annihilate the Jews.

The most important question was never addressed by either Butz or any of his compatriots: Why, if the "propagandists" responsible for the hoax were so successful at producing such a vast array of documents, did they not produce the one piece of paper deniers claim would convince them there had been a Final Solution – that is, an order from Hitler authorizing the destruction of the Jews?

Deborah Lipstadt: „Denying the Holocaust – The growing assault on truth and memory”, pp. 126-128

Quote:If the Holocaust was truly a fraud perpetrated by the Jews, one could legitimately expect a powerful force like "World Jewry" to have seen to it that no discrepancies were allowed to creep into research by Jewish scholars. All their findings should neatly dovetail with and confirm one another. And if the "Talmudists" were crafty enough to recognize that precise conformity might arouse suspicion, they would have ensured that there was only the slightest variation among scholars' findings.

But this, of course, is not the only inconsistency in App's arguments. At the same time that he described Israeli archives as playing a pivotal role in the "swindle," he also used their findings to validate his own. In an attempt to prove that even Israeli institutions have been unable to document the number of dead, App cited a statement by Yad Vashem, the national memorial to the victims in Israel, that it has been able to gather only 2.5 million pages of testimony. App argued that if in the years since the end of the war Yad Vashem had been unable to document even 4 million, it was because there had not been that many. Even the 2.5 million figures they supplied were nothing but "a lie and a swindle.'' But if Yad Vashem was as App depicted it – an Israeli institution at the heart of the hoax – it should have had no difficulty forging the additional documentation needed to fill the quotient of six million.

More recently the Institute for Historical Review published a report from the Jerusalem Post in which the director of Yad Vashem's archives reported that more than half of its testimonies from Holocaust survivors are "unreliable." According to Yad Vashem officials, these testimonies have never been used as evidence in Nazi war crimes trials because survivors who wanted to be "part of history" may, in fact, have allowed their imaginations to "run away with them." For the deniers this was further evidence of a "hoax." What the Institute for Historical Review could not ask, given its ideological predilections, was the question of why Yad Vashem would acknowledge that some of its archival holdings are incorrect if its objective was to perpetuate the Holocaust "myth." Why did it not simply replace these testimonies with "correct" ones? Why did it not have its researchers further "falsify" the data? If Jews were able to forge documents sufficient to convict Nazi war criminals within a few months after the war, they should certainly have been able to deposit reliable and historically accurate testimonies in Yad Vashem in the decades since then. This simplistic and yet deceptive claim is but another example of the deniers' use of tactics that conveniently either ignore proof of the Holocaust or twist it in a way that substantiates their conspiracy theory.

App's faulty arguments regarding the scholarly dispute about the number of victims and his use of statements and figures from Yad Vashem to prove his point were not the only occasions when he became ensnared in his own attempts to manipulate the evidence. In The Six Million Swindle he also attacked a journalist who had written that the Nazis wished to kill "as many Jews as possible" before the end of the war. In order to substantiate his charge that this journalist was lying, App cited Himmler's fall 1944 order prohibiting any further execution of Jews. This evidence, he argued, proved two things: First the Nazis did not wish to kill as many Jews as possible, for if so Himmler would not have halted the killings. Second, he argued, it showed that Himmler, not Hitler, was in charge of Jewish policy. In his attempt to exonerate both the Nazis in general and Hitler in particular by laying the blame for this policy at Himmler's doorstep, App ignores a basic contradiction in his argument: If there was not a policy to kill the Jews, what then was Himmler ordering stopped?

Here and elsewhere App's approach to evidence is reminiscent of Rassinier's arguments regarding eyewitness accounts. It is the standard method by which deniers dismiss evidence which contradicts their conclusions. All affidavits by Nazis admitting the existence of a Final Solution are declared "outright frauds," and all testimony by Jews regarding mass murder is "in part or whole perjured, often well rewarded and altogether unreliable." This blanket denial of the validity of any evidence attesting to the Holocaust, including that of eyewitnesses, has become a centerpiece of the deniers' methodology. Simply put, anything that disagrees with their foregone conclusion is dismissed. Because of the sheer number of affidavits by survivors, perpetrators, and eyewitnesses, unless the deniers categorically dismiss this mass of evidence they cannot perpetrate their own hoax.

Deborah Lipstadt: „Denying the Holocaust – The growing assault on truth and memory”, pp. 101-102

Quote:Butz's preference for documents notwithstanding, he still had to explain away those defendants who said, "I was there," "I saw the killings," or "I heard Hitler and Himmler speak of the extermination of the Jews." Indeed, Butz's resourcefulness in this regard constitutes the most "creative" aspect of his book. Breaking ranks with previous deniers, he dismissed the explanation that the only reason Nuremberg defendants confessed was because they had been tortured into admitting their guilt.

He argued that they recognized that since the world was convinced that a Holocaust had taken place, they could not possibly deny it and hope to be believed. Though they had done no wrong, the world was intent on finding them guilty. Since protesting their innocence would have been counterproductive, the defendants and their lawyers decided that the best tactic was to plead guilty. This approach provided Butz with a reply to one of the most oft-heard criticisms directed at deniers: If the Holocaust is a hoax why did the Nazi defendants themselves acknowledge that it happened? For Butz it was all quite simple : It was better to admit to the crime of the century and risk losing one's life than to protest against a monstrous fraud. However, in pursuing this theory, Butz ignored a basic problem: If the end result promised to be the same – a death sentence – what purpose was served by falsely pleading guilty to such a vicious act?

Deborah Lipstadt: „Denying the Holocaust – The growing assault on truth and memory”, p. 130

[GasseGeir]

I wish to remind everyone that during Ernst Zündel's trials in Toronto in 1985 and 1988 not a single "Holocaust survivor" was willing to swear an oath and say in court that he or she had seen any holocaust in the Nazi concentration camps.

So ... what witnesses?

[nitink]

[GasseGeir]

The real holocaust:















http://www.read-all-about-it.org/gruesom...tents.html

[Frank2]

http://concen.org/forum/thread-15910-pos...#pid251894

[GasseGeir]

Frank2

What's your problem? Can't we have more than 1 Holohoax thread? Btw - how do you react to the information that millions of your own people, the Germans, were exterminated *after* WWII was over? Not important to you? You only care about Jews?

[SirBustaBear]

(11-10-2012 05:08 PM)GasseGeir Wrote:  I wish to remind everyone that during Ernst Zündel's trials in Toronto in 1985 and 1988 not a single "Holocaust survivor" was willing to swear an oath and say in court that he or she had seen any holocaust in the Nazi concentration camps.

And that disproves what exactly? It's a "clever" trick of Mr. Zündel to make a demand that he knows will probably not be fulfilled – and then go: See?

Why is it hard to fulfil? Because a) the main victims are obviously dead and cannot testify before court anymore, b) the only other prisoners allowed to witness it were the Sonderkommandos, and they were killed off regularly to make sure there were not too many witnesses. Only 110 are said to have survived. There were no open sightseeing tours for all the prisoners and the ones determined for forced labor were living in a different district of Auschwitz for example. And c) he's making this demand decades after the event, knowing that a significant percentage that could have directly observed it is probably dead already.

Apart from that I could imagine a lot of reasons why genuine Shoah survivors would not want to appear in that trial: maybe they just don't want to give Mr. Zündel, an incorrible ideologue, a platform. Many of the surviving Sonderkommandos do not want to speak in public at all – again a lot of reasons for that are imaginable. But deniers want to construct a case out of that.

And of course Mr. Zündel's demand implies that he is ignoring all the court trials before his and dismissing the documented testimonies coming from them. No serious historian would do that.

Very "clever": make a most specific demand and if that is not fulfilled it allows one to ignore any existing evidence.

(11-15-2012 09:30 AM)nitink Wrote:  There are fewer witnesses to the extermination of the Jews in the gas chambers than is commonly assumed

How many direct witnesses would be "sufficient"? 200? 200.000? Especially given the circumstances mentioned above it is remarkable that there are direct witnesses at all who have testified. Of course there are many more hearsay accounts supporting these testimonies, but we know you people will dismiss all of them as "unreliable".

Deposition of 24th May 1945 by Henryk Tauber
Former member of the Sonderkommando of Krematorien I, II, IV and V
[Annex 18 to Volume XI of the Hoess trial]
Published in Jean-Claude Pressac's "Auschwitz: Technique and Operation of the Gas Chambers"
http://www.holocaust-history.org/auschwi...0481.shtml

(11-15-2012 09:30 AM)nitink Wrote:  There are NO forensic or documentary proofs for the mass killings of Jews in the gas chambers

You better take an example in Jean-Claude Pressac. He was once was a "revisionist" himself until he went to the archives and studied the construction plans and orders for Auschwitz. He wrote he "wanted to do away with himself" once his belief system was entirely shattered by the evidence. He wasn't a Jew or anything else where you guys would claim he had an agenda. Originally he went for a career in the military, then was a disciple of Robert Faurisson. Fortunately for him and the world he has a VERY inquiring and critical mind and wanted to know exactly. He considered ALL possible explanations while viewing the documents and came to the conclusion that the Shoah is a historical reality. And yes, this includes the gas chambers. Read his book to follow his reasoning.

Jean-Claude Pressac: "Auschwitz: Technique and Operation of the Gas Chambers"

[GasseGeir]

(11-21-2012 10:54 AM)SirBustaBear Wrote:  Why is it hard to fulfil? Because a) the main victims are obviously dead and cannot testify before court anymore

Bullshit.

By 1985/1988 there were scores of Jews alive who were writing books and giving interviews, etc., about the big Nazi gassing party that they miraculously survived. The thing is that Zündel's lawyer would make the Jews swear an oath in line with strict Jewish tradition and nobody was willing to swear this oath - as they knew they were full of shit and never saw any gassing business.

I can tell you're just pulling your arguments out of thin air.

The facts:

1. We have absolutely zero evidence that the German Nazis holocausted a single Jew.

2. We have absolutely no reliable witness testimony whatsoever that confirms the holostory.

3. He have an abundance of witness testimony saying no holocaust happened. Other than the holocaust the Jews/Allies gave the Germans + the holocaust the Jews in Russia gave the Russians.

Here's what the holoexperts are saying: http://www.polskawalczaca.com/viewtopic....406d2039c8

C'mon now - prove that the Nazis holocausted (preferably gassed) a single Jew in WWII.

[SirBustaBear]

Some more logical consideration that speak against the theory of the Shoah being a "myth":

Quote:Goebbels' diary, for example, was barely rescued from being sold as 7,000 pages of scrap paper […] In any case, most of the diary is quite mundane, and interesting only to historians. Did the supposed Jewish conspiracy forge seven thousand pages to insert just a few lines? How did they manage to know Goebbels' affairs intimately enough to avoid contradictions, e.g. putting him or his associates in the wrong city at the wrong date? […] As even the revisionist David Cole has admitted, revisionists have yet to provide a satisfactory explanation of this document.

Quote:Regarding postwar testimony from Nazis, were they all tortured into confessing to heinous crimes which they supposedly did not commit? This might be believable if only a few Nazis were captured after the war, or maybe if some had courageously stood up in court and shouted to the world about the supposed attempt to silence them. But hundreds testified regarding the Holocaust, in trials dating from late 1945 until the 1960s. (For example, see Böck, Hofmann, Hössler, Klein, Münch, and Stark.)

Many of these Nazis testified as witnesses and were not accused of crimes. What was the basis for their supposed coercion?

Many of these trials were in German courts. Did the Germans torture their own countrymen? Well, Holocaust-deniers sometimes claim that the Jews have secretly infiltrated the German government and control everything about it. They prefer not to talk too much about this theory, however, because it is clearly on the lunatic fringe.

[…]

Holocaust-deniers point to small discrepancies in testimonies to try to discredit them. The assumption, unstated, is that the reader will accept minor discrepancies as evidence of a vast, over-reaching Jewish conspiracy. This is clearly ludicrous.

In fact, the discrepancies and minor errors in detail argue against, not for, the conspiracy theory. Why would the conspirators have given different information to different Nazis? In fact, if all the testimonies, from the Nazis' to the inmates', sounded too similar, it is certain that the Holocaust-deniers would cite that as evidence of a conspiracy.

Quote:Letters and telegrams exchanged on February 11 and 12 [1943] between the Zentralbauleitung and Topf mention a wooden blower for Leichenkeller 1. This reference confirms the use of the morgue as a gas chamber: Bischoff and Prüfer thought that the extraction of air mixed with concentrated prussic acid [cyanide] (20 g per cu m) required a noncorroding ventilator.

Bischoff and Prüfer turned out to be wrong, and a metal fan ended up working acceptably well. But the fact that they thought it necessary demonstrates that cyanide was to be routinely used in the rooms which deniers call morgues. (Cyanide is useless for disinfecting morgues, as it does not kill bacteria.)

Quote:Other captured documents, even if they don't refer directly to some part of the extermination process, refer to it by implication. A captured memo to SS-Brigadeführer Kammler reveals that the expected incineration capacity of the Auschwitz ovens was a combined total of 4,756 corpses per day (see a photograph of the document or Kogon, op. cit., p. 157).

Deniers often claim that this total could not be achieved in practice (see question 45). That's not the point. These crematoria were carefully designed, in 1942, to have sufficient capacity to dispose of 140,000 corpses per month -- in a camp that housed only 125,000. We can conclude that massive deaths were predicted, indeed planned-for, as early as mid-1942. A camp designed to incinerate its full capacity of inmates every four weeks is not merely a detention center.

Quote:In summary:

"Revisionists" often claim, correctly, that the burden of proof is on historians. The proof, of course, has been a matter of public record since late 1945, and is available in libraries around the world. The burden has been met, many, many times over. You've just seen a brief presentation of some of the highlights of that immense body of proof; much more is readily available.

To even argue that the Holocaust never happened is ludicrous. To claim straight-faced that none of this proof even exists is beyond ludicrous, and it is a clear example of "revisionist" dishonesty.

Read the full article with many references and links to the evidence here:

1. What proof exists that the Nazis practiced genocide or deliberately killed six million Jews?
http://www.nizkor.org/features/qar/qar01.html

Come on, show me the documentary proof (written orders etc.) for this massive conspiracy.

[GasseGeir]

(11-21-2012 03:38 PM)SirBustaBear Wrote:  Come on, show me the documentary proof (written orders etc.) for this massive conspiracy.

You are the crazy conspiracy theorist - not me.

You claim that for some inexplicable reason, in the middle of a long and demanding war, the Nazis decided to kill 6 million harmless Jews in the most idiotic and inefficient way possible - secretly - in the middle of densely populated concentration camps. And you have absolutely zero evidence to show for it.

Prove that the Nazis holocausted a single Jew.

A few Jewish mothers and babies the Nazis forgot to holocaust at Dachau:



People with bad health being liberated from the infirmary in Auschwitz by the Soviets:



"They gassed those that couldn't work ..."



"Welcome to the super hi-tech Nazi gas chamber. Be sure to close the air-tight door."

[Frank2]

oh Jesus, what's next the swimming pool at Birkenau?

cherry pickers.

on the original architectural manifest for the shower rooms the nazis specifically made requirements for GAS PROOF DOORS- see if you can find that

[GasseGeir]

(11-21-2012 04:43 PM)Frank2 Wrote:  see if you can find that

Sorry, buddy. I'm not doing your work.