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The Sura 4:82 Challenge To All Muslims. - aux - 05-21-2007 09:15 PM
Maybe now some people can understand why my first message asked if this was a joke. Sad part is, it prolly isn't.
Peace in Christ Jesus all.
PS- Crack kills
The Sura 4:82 Challenge To All Muslims. - Starjade - 05-22-2007 10:52 AM
Well hello again AUX my goodness you have been busy thinking. Clearly you have a bigger backbone than those shirking Muslims. :D
I have not yet had a chance to read all that you have said but I have saved it all to disk to reply to later so please have some patience. Oh and do bear in mind that there are moderators on this forum who do not appreciate my popularity and so if i get banned or am unable to reply please email me where i shall give you a link to a forum where our conversations will not be tampered with and where they appreciate good writers and you will have total freedom of speach.
The Sura 4:82 Challenge To All Muslims. - Starjade - 05-22-2007 11:03 AM
Quote:Starjade says; Yes that is the Prophecy that I have been giving Chapter and verse to. It is a fact that I was first born in the Blackpool of Lancashire, I grew up in the midst of all kinds of Jews who are the brethren of all other Jews living or dead. It does not say that long awaited Prophet would be a Jew. It only says that Prophet would be raised up in the midst of the Jews. And I was.
Quote:AUX you said; Okay, but there are probably several millions who can claim to be this Prophet based on the qualifications you have cited so far.
Starjade says; Actually you are mistaken on that thought aux because in this Planets existence in the whole of history I am the only Prophet who can be proven to be a Prophet with a provable connection to the Living God by the law of Deuteronomy Chapter 19 verse 15.
What is more Jesus and Mad Muhammad and Sabbatai Zevi are the only others who are claiming that they are that Prophet. At least to my knowledge. Sabbatai Zevi was proven a fraud when he rejected Judaism and was forced to become a Muslim which leaves only Jesus and Mad Muhammad as the pretenders to my Throne and neither of them can satisfy that specific law of Deuteronomy Chapter 19 verse 15.
For those who know of me and my conversations with the religious congregations it is clear that I am an expert in my field of religious knowledge and Christianity and Islam and their followers have always bitten the Dust unable to defend their religions from my Revelations.
There is only one Deuteronomy King of the Apocalyptic Castle and that King is the one and only much loved Doomsday Prophet Starjade.
And as you see I am the challenger and I am challenging the religious congregations and demanding an account from them and they are afraid of my Revelations.
The Sura 4:82 Challenge To All Muslims. - Starjade - 05-22-2007 11:16 AM
Quote:Starjade says; It makes no difference where Daniel was. It was a point of the origin of Gabriel. The name Gabriel was first mentioned in the Old Testament by Daniel.
Quote:aux you said; Correction, it makes no difference to Starjade, where Daniel was when he first wrote of Gabriel, the messenger, the one sent to give and explain a prophecy in Daniel’s vision. There, now you’re statement isn’t just your opinion, and qualifies as a fact if indeed you really don’t think it makes a difference.Starjade says; Daniel described a man not any Angel. Daniel was asleep during that dream and that is written for all to see. So it does not make any difference where he was only what he actually said. Daniel did not describe any Angel but did describe a man. If you think otherwise show where Daniel says he saw an Angel called Gabriel and not make suppositions in the hope it would give authenticity to your religious beliefs.
Quote:Starjade says; It was the origin of Gabriel that I was speaking about and there was no mention of any Angel called Gabriel. We all have Bibles of one form or another. And so it is a simple matter to check.
Quote:Aux you said; It’s also a simple matter to check what the word angel actually means. If you didn’t get it the first time I wrote it, here it goes again: Angel is a descriptive term that means ‘messenger’ or ‘one sent.’ The word is used in scripture to distinguish a person not of the seed of Adam who is commissioned for some purpose from God. Satan has angels as well. Gabriel is said to have the ‘appearance of a man.’ If he was just a man, it would be understood he appeared as one, the fact that it is specifically stated Gabriel ‘appeared’ as a man couldn’t make it any more clear that he was not just an ordinary man. There is biblical precedence for angels being called men as early as Genesis, a book Daniel would have known well.Starjade says; That just is not good enough for Daniel describes a man call another man by the name of Gabriel. Daniel thought all his dreams carried a message. A next door neighbour can carry a message do you think that makes them angels as well.
Luke on the other hand describes an Angel and so does Muhammad. But the writers of the character Luke invented this Angel Gabriel just as the tales of the Angel Gabriel are established to be untrue by Deuteronomy law due to the lack of witnesses to this Angel Gabriel and the stories surrounding that Angel Gabriel.
I have shown you many points where the claims about the angel called Gabriel are illogical and stand against the actual word of the Living God as stated by several people in the history of this planet. These claims then are established to be untrue and are simply tales intent to beguile.
The Sura 4:82 Challenge To All Muslims. - Starjade - 05-22-2007 11:26 AM
Quote:Starjade says; Whiles we are speaking of biblical statements we should stick to biblical statements and not get side tracked into conversations of what others yackle on about Gabriel or their beliefs in an Angel called Gabriel.
Quote:aux you said; Fair enough. I can agree with that. However, you’ve already broken your own rule, because you have a habit of asserting your own opinions on what Gabriel was in the book of Daniel and the origin of Gabriel in the book of Luke. You’re opinions have no authority outside of your own mind.
Starjade says; I have the Living Gods authority to speak. The Living God did not send any Angel called Gabriel to stand against the Living Gods word to proclaim Jesus and Muhammad as being that Deuteronomy Prophet that the Living God promised Moses he would raise up. The evidence stares you in the face. I read Daniel and he described a man not an angel. Daniel hardly spoke much about that man called Gabriel either.
I read everything the character Luke wrote about this angel Gabriel and it is all hearsay testimony to matters that are not established as being true by Deuteronomy Chapter 19 verse 15 law which is a law that determines matters of the truth regarding any crimes of iniquity and sin. Such crimes are committed by the writers of the character Luke. None of the New Testament claims about this Angel Gabriel can be verified or authenticated by witnesses and the events described are not events the character Luke was being a witness to. That fact continues beyond Luke to Mathew Mark and John. They do not give actual witness Testimony.
The Sura 4:82 Challenge To All Muslims. - Starjade - 05-22-2007 11:32 AM
Quote:Starjade says; Those who believe in an Angel Gabriel are either Christians and Muslims. The Muslims only believe because of Christian blabbery of which Muhammad believed which is another nail in his coffin.
Quote:aux you said “Whiles we are speaking of biblical statements we should stick to biblical statements and not get side tracked into conversations of what others yackle on about Gabriel or their beliefs in an Angel called Gabriel.”
Starjade says; hahaha but you know that you were speaking then of the New Testament and inventing tales of your own instead of sticking to word for word verses. The Muslims are a part of this conversations for they got their views of the Angel Gabriel from Christianity also. The Koran and the claims of Muhammad are based on the tales of the Angel Gabriel and so they are not a side tract but an extension onto the conversations about this fabricated angel Gabriel and also further proof that the Angel Gabriel is a fabricated fraud.
The Sura 4:82 Challenge To All Muslims. - Starjade - 05-22-2007 11:39 AM
Quote:aux you said; You're opinions not only don't belong in this discussion, but you are categorically wrong, but don't take it from me this Jewish website has a Jew explaining at least one Jewish school of thought on angels and admits Gabriel is an angel. http://www.jtnews.net/index.php?/columnists/item/35/C9/
Starjade says: One Jewish school of thought is not all Jewish though. Perhaps you forget the Jews easily build for themselves golden calfs. Some Jews believe in Jesus and others in Muhammad at one time they believed in a calf of gold. I have little interest in the beliefs of a few when I have common sense. Never mind what others think but read and study for yourself. Daniel described a man not any angel. There are Angels in the Old Testament but no Angel Gabriel. That Angel Gabriel is established by Deuteronomy law and common sense to be a fraud.
The Sura 4:82 Challenge To All Muslims. - Starjade - 05-22-2007 11:41 AM
I gotta go but will return later.
The Sura 4:82 Challenge To All Muslims. - ticaret - 05-22-2007 12:54 PM
4:82 infers to the solidarity of the Muslims with there being no schisms or disputes with regards to their faith in respect to what has been written in the Holy Quran.
Whereas, historically and as correctly stated by our Beloved Prophet:
"Verily, the nations before you were destroyed because of their disagreements over the Book."
"before you" refers to those nations of faith before the advent of the nation adhering to the Holy Quran.
You see there were no councils held like that within the Christian faith so as to determine and debate what to beleive and what had been said in the Gospels.
The significant difference is that within Islam the Holy Quran is considered infallible whereas within Christianity, as endosed by the councils, the Church is only considered infallible and that the institution has the perpetuated authority of Christ there-by having the authority for all time to overide the Gospels whereas there being no clergy or institution as such in Islam, only scholars and leaders in prayer, any claim to overide the Holy Quran would be seen as leaving the fold of faith.
Peace
The Sura 4:82 Challenge To All Muslims. - deathstickboy - 05-22-2007 01:32 PM
Obviously, Murad has never heard of the Council of Niciea. :rolleyes:
And don't act like all of islam is unified either, cause thats just fucking silly....
Islamic religious scholars and leaders in prayer occupy the same effective role as clergymen, and one thing Islamic nations have in addition to a "clergy", is "Morality Police", which is the most backwards and fucked up institution I've ever heard of. A sure way to ensure corruption and rape.
The Sura 4:82 Challenge To All Muslims. - Starjade - 05-22-2007 02:17 PM
Quote:Murad you say; 4:82 infers to the solidarity of the Muslims with there being no schisms or disputes with regards to their faith in respect to what has been written in the Holy Quran.
Starjade says; well hello there Murad. The Sura 4:82 was a challenge and a brag of trust and faith by Muslims and their belief in the Koran and the religion of Islam. They claim the challenge has existed unchallenged for 1400 and more now years. But I do know others have challenged it in the past even before me but it was not reported.
The Koran has been established to be a book that did not come from God and no book is holy. When a Muslim challenged me with the Sura 4:82 at no time did he expect that I could name hundreds of errors that are found in the Koran because he was like a sheep and trusted. It was such a shock to his system. It is always a shock to every Muslim I meet. Now however, Islam has an even bigger problem. That of course is the arrival of the real Deuteronomy Chapter 18 verses 15/18 Prophet. Now I am demanding that account from the moon worshippers of Islam and I can convert Muslims away from Islam and from the Koran and the claims of Muhammad using Islamic law and the words of the Koran itself. Now that I think must be something new.
Quote:Murad you say; Whereas, historically and as correctly stated by our Beloved Prophet: "Verily, the nations before you were destroyed because of their disagreements over the Book."
Starjade says; Wassis I did not say any such thing. I do not need to disagree. I simply show staggering amounts of errors in the Koran and as the Sura 4;82 states if errors are found in the Koran then that is the proof that the Koran does not come from God. The Islamic law I always invoke when speaking of Islam and the Koran and the silly claims of Muhammad force the Muslims to convert because the Koran is proven to not come from God by its own admission. I have already converted some very hard core wanna cut your heads off Muslims. And that was easy. Have you got anymore? Send them this way.
Quote:"before you" refers to those nations of faith before the advent of the nation adhering to the Holy Quran.
Starjade says; Follow Islam or you will die is how the blasphemy of the Koran was spread. Now that tale is worn thin and Islam has bitten the Dust and by a few simple words it crumbles.
Quote:Murad you say; You see there were no councils held like that within the Christian faith so as to determine and debate what to believe and what had been said in the Gospels.
Starjade says; but there has always been the law of Deuteronomy Chapter 19 verse 15 and that binds all the Jews who are the descendants of Abraham including the Christians who attempt to steal the glory and Prophecies of the Jews religion. Deuteronomy Chapter 19 verse 15 is a law that determines matters of the truth regarding crimes of iniquity or sin. That is also a law brought down by Moses from the Living God and it is then Gods word. That does decide in Judgement what should be believed or not.
Quote:Murad you say; The significant difference is that within Islam the Holy Quran is considered infallible whereas within Christianity, as endorsed by the councils, the Church is only considered infallible and that the institution has the perpetuated authority of Christ there-by having the authority for all time to overide the Gospels
Starjade says: The Koran is not infallible and writing in the Sura 4:82 makes the Koran even more easier to bite the Dust and show Muslims with common sense under Islamic law that the Koran does not come from God. I have already established the Koran does not come from God but the message is rather slow in getting about. Be certain your Islamic leaders and Islamic scholars know of my power to grind the Koran down to dust.
As for Christianity and their silly tales of that fraud Jesus hahaha I caused Christianity to bite the Dust a long Time ago. Two over twenty years Christian ordained ministers tried to defend the claims of the New Testament from my Revelations and they both bit the Dust. One actually bragged the brag that he was the one who could stand against me and put me in my place as he claimed. But after I gave him my Revelations he shut his mouth and ran away to bury his head in the sand. He did not return to defend the brags he had made. His name by the way is Bruce Evens Murch. If you meet him tell him I am still laughing.
Christianity and Islam are on very week ground and their religions are even weaker. Only the Old Testament stands the test of time with its Prophecies. Except of course for the naked unicorn lover Isaiah believing in unicorns coming at the End of Times. But what can you say about a man who walks around naked for years looking for signs from God. Hahaha now there is one who flew way over the cuckoos nest.
Quote:Murad you say; whereas there being no clergy or institution as such in Islam, only scholars and leaders in prayer, any claim to overide the Holy Quran would be seen as leaving the fold of faith. Peace
Starjade says; yeah but your Imams are the same as the Christians title of Priest. But as you say all it really means to be an Imam is that they memorised the Koran. Oh and that they advocate the worship of the moon which used to be called Sin by the way as in the original worship in Sin.
I can see that you also are something of a religious scholar Murad. I hope we can have many long debates. But be wary for I have already invoked Islamic law in the very beginnings and no way are you or your religious leaders in any position to defend Islam from my Revelations which as that Islamic law states means that you will have to reject the Koran and the claims of Muhammad. Now where does Islam stand when Islamic law states you must reject the Koran and the claims of Muhammad because they are not true and are seen as being something detestable in the eyes of the living God.
The Sura 4:82 Challenge To All Muslims. - Starjade - 05-22-2007 02:22 PM
Quote:deathstickboy Obviously, Murad has never heard of the Council of Niciea.
And don't act like all of islam is unified either, cause thats just fucking silly....
Starjade says; It is just an Islamic propaganda claim. In fact Sunny Muslims and Shia Muslims show that example that islam is not a unified religion. That was brought about by there being different worded Korans that neither side would give up and both sides claim as being authentic. Too bad ole Muhammad could not recall all his speeches for today the Sunny and Shia Muslims murder kill and maim each other and in their Temples when all along every Koran is false as can be proven for a fact and by the Sura 4:82 of the Koran.
Quote:deathstickboy Islamic religious scholars and leaders in prayer occupy the same effective role as clergymen, and one thing Islamic nations have in addition to a "clergy", is "Morality Police", which is the most backwards and fucked up institution I've ever heard of. A sure way to ensure corruption and rape.]
Starjade says; Yes evil thrives in Islam and also in Christian Churches. Tsk Tsk TskĀ ..
The Sura 4:82 Challenge To All Muslims. - Starjade - 05-22-2007 02:48 PM
Quote:aux you said; You're opinions not only don't belong in this discussion, but you are categorically wrong, but don't take it from me this Jewish website has a Jew explaining at least one Jewish school of thought on angels and admits Gabriel is an angel. http://www.jtnews.net/index.php?/columnists/item/35/C9/
Starjade says: One Jewish school of thought is not all Jewish though. Perhaps you forget the Jews easily build for themselves golden calves. Some Jews believe in Jesus and others in Muhammad at one time they believed in a calf of gold and others the moon. I have little interest in the beliefs of a few when I have a thing called common sense. Never mind what others think but read and study for your self. Daniel described a man not any angel. There are Angels in the Old Testament but no Angel Gabriel. That Angel Gabriel is established to be a fraud.
Never you mind what Jews think. Take little heed. Instead study their religion and their laws and the history of those people. That then will be more than they know. Why even the Jews believe that the long awaited Deuteronomy Chapter 18 verses 15/18 will be a Jew. But the living God has never said that Deuteronomy Prophet would be a Jew. Only that he would be raised up in the midst of the Jews. So whiles they are entitled to have an opinion that is all they are voicing and they do not voice the facts seen to be said but of things they suppose to be said.
Quote:Aux you say; Here's a quote: "2. Humility. Before bedtime, we recite a prayer that evokes the names of the four most renowned angels: Michael, Gabriel, Uriel and Raphael. These angels are said to escort us wherever we walk, with the Divine shechinah above us. One stands to the right, one to the left, one in front and one behind."
Starjade says; (sigh) so what these are not historical facts. Why people also talk of Santa Claus and the Tooth fairy.
Quote:aux you say; When are you going to learn anything starjade?
Starjade says; I am the teacher of knowledge not you. I am the challenger of many major religions not you. I have the most staggering and the most startling Revelations and have learned more than your mind could grasp even from before I stepped onto the path that I am travelling.
Quote:Starjade says; It is openly written in the Old Testament and I have given you the chapter and verses and so it is not a misconception it is a religious fact. You cannot alter those words as a matter of personal convenience.
Quote:aux you said; Who is altering? I simply maintain that angels are referred to as men in the bible, specifically the Old Testament. This stance is biblically sound and quite frankly I’m astonished you would even have a problem accepting it. For all the pomp and glory you ride in on, being such a religious expert, nay, a Prophet, it’s truly amazing you would overlook Genesis 19, where angels are referred to as men numerous times (just as Daniel referred to Gabriel as a man). Here, let me help you out and show you exactly what I’m talking about
Starjade says; You were altering the text written in the Old Testament to suit your personal views such as you saying form instead of appearance. I can deal with the many varying text of varying bibles but when you start re inventing those tales someone has to say stop. The Old Testament does mention angels. It does not mention any Angel Gabriel. If you think otherwise then back your mouth up and show us all chapter and verse. Some angels have come to mankind in the shape of man. However, as the living Gods Prophet I can tell you that such angelic beings glow of a particular brilliant white light not like anything here on earth.
In Daniels Dream however, he was speaking of a man not any Angel and even he describes a man. So it is not alright for someone else to come along and claim that a man is an Angel when the story is not about any Angel.
The Sura 4:82 Challenge To All Muslims. - Starjade - 05-22-2007 02:51 PM
Quote:Genesis 19:
1. And there came two angels to Sodom at even; and Lot sat in the gate of Sodom: and Lot seeing [them] rose up to meet them; and he bowed himself with his face toward the ground;
2 And he said, Behold now, my lords (a title given to men, notice the lowercase L), turn in, I pray you, into your servant's house, and tarry all night, and wash your feet, and ye shall rise up early, and go on your ways. And they said, Nay; but we will abide in the street all night.
3 And he pressed upon them greatly; and they turned in unto him, and entered into his house; and he made them a feast, and did bake unleavened bread, and they did eat. (we see angels can eat food like men)
Starjade says; My comments were about Daniel though. No Angel called Gabriel is mentioned here. Furthermore, in astral form no Angel can eat food no matter what any say. They have etheric astral bodies and solid matter would simply fall through them. Rather an odd statement altogether actually for if you saw a real angel the last question or thought on your mind would be a wish to wash their feet. You would be asking where they came from if you could recover from the shock. You should be careful about believing in unsubstantiated tales.
Quote:4. But before they lay down, the men of the city, [even] the men of Sodom, compassed the house round, both old and young, all the people from every quarter:
5 And they called unto Lot, and said unto him, Where [are] the men (first instance of men calling angels men, likely unwittingly, but that is beside the point) which came in to thee this night? bring them out unto us, that we may know them.
Starjade says: Now then others come along wanting to meet those they saw as men. Had Angels appeared on such a nasty place then all would be amazed and at peace. Not as angels from God because they wanted to search out the G. Spot. As you claim unwittingly but we have only the writer’s word that Lot saw Angels. They also liked tall tales in their preaching’s in the Old Testament as well you know. I personally think that tale told was done from a moralising viewpoint. Not from actual reality.
Quote:6 And Lot went out at the door unto them, and shut the door after him,
7 And said, I pray you, brethren, do not so wickedly.
8 Behold now, I have two daughters which have not known man; let me, I pray you, bring them out unto you, and do ye to them as [is] good in your eyes: only unto these men (Lot refers to the two angels as men) do nothing; for therefore came they under the shadow of my roof.
9 And they said, Stand back. And they said [again], This one [fellow] came in to sojourn, and he will needs be a judge: now will we deal worse with thee, than with them. And they pressed sore upon the man, [even] Lot, and came near to break the door.
10 But the men (here, the Word refers to the angels as men, this was not Lot or the Sodomites speaking, but the Word) put forth their hand, and pulled Lot into the house to them, and shut to the door.
11 And they smote the men that [were] at the door of the house with blindness, both small and great: so that they wearied themselves to find the door.
12. And the men (the Word once again, without stuttering, refers to angels as men) said unto Lot, Hast thou here any besides? son in law, and thy sons, and thy daughters, and whatsoever thou hast in the city, bring [them] out of this place:
13 For we will destroy this place, because the cry of them is waxen great before the face of the LORD; and the LORD hath sent us to destroy it.
Starjade says; It is rather silly to assume that any man could hurt an Angel from God. They are not of this world and their bodies may appear real but are not and so they would have nothing to fear. Lot is said to have offered up his daughters to those maggots whiles I would cut off Lots head for that suggestion. I do see the point you are trying to make but Daniel was not speaking of any Angel called Gabriel he was speaking of a man.
The Sura 4:82 Challenge To All Muslims. - Starjade - 05-22-2007 03:04 PM
Quote:Now just as the men in this passage refer to angels as men, Daniel, as a man, referred to the angel Gabriel as a man, which seems to have you stumbling despite all the contrary evidence stacked against you; but more importantly, the inspired Word itself refers to angels as men, not to be confused with Lot or the Sodomites, or any other men of the seed of Adam. It doesn’t get any clearer than this. Gabriel delivered some of the most impressive prophecies in the entire bible, but you’ll have us believe that he was just a man or not even real? This totally undermines your own (false) claim to Prophet hood as it rests in the same Old Testament that Daniel does. I could stop here now, but just to make an example of you I’ll indulge you’re attention-seeking adventure.
Starjade says; Oh no he does not. He refers to Gabriel as being just a man and named by another man. It is just you wish he was speaking of an angel but he does not. In Lots story he identified those as being angels first then as men and they had no names. Daniel does not speak of Angels and he names only a man he saw in a dream call another man by the name of Gabriel. That was the first mention of Gabriel yet you claim Prophecies all over the Bible from Gabriel. What you really mean is only in the New Testament where an Angel called Gabriel was invented.
Angels from God do exist but not in mankind’s dreams. Adam by the way was originally Adamon and means the first of man kind and is not then a name of a man but of the first of mankind. Unless of course you want to also argue a man called Adam was also an Angel as well eh?
This Gabriel you speak about delivered no Prophecies throughout the Bible. That is you fantasying again. Name those Prophecies chapter and verse.
Quote:Aux you said; Now, Mr. Starjade, you have a chance to show us what kind of person we are really dealing with here. I have a feeling I know what your next trick will be though as you get desperate, if only just to keep the false self-construct you’ve built for yourself from collapsing in a heap of deceit. Try accepting the truth for once, it’s much more rewarding.
Starjade says; You are dealing with much more than a man. But with the living Gods Doomsday Prophet who has already spoken on the issue of the Angel Gabriel. I am the one who is speaking the truth when I point out that the Angel Gabriel is a fraud invented to glorify the false Prophet Jesus. Name two or three actual witnesses in accordance with Deuteronomy Chapter 19 verse 15 law and show their actual witness Testimonies.